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Switch to Forum Live View Muslim men prefer non-Muslim women
10 years ago  ::  Jan 02, 2008 - 10:28AM #41
GraceSA
Posts: 1,101
[QUOTE=endgame;180252]aslaamualaikum all,
It seems that everyone is in agreement that there is a need for a proper venue for muslim men and women to interact with each other. What are people's suggesstions on these proper venues? What is the proper islamic etiquette in everyone's opinion as far as cross-gender interaction is concerned? When does one go too far? Is there a need to police the interaction?[/QUOTE]

This is a difficult questiong to answer- but I would like to address something even more foundational.  The community (especially parents) need to discuss inter-gender relationships with the youth.  I don't just mean telling them, "haram, haram, haram".  They tune that out.  They need to know why- and the social effects.  It is too soon to say my final results yet, but I have gone over with my kids, AIDS, STDS, emotional aspects of sex, practical social consequences of premarital sex,   They know I expect them to abstain.  They also know about condoms.  I know that I can not choose what choices they will make.  But I have done my best to inform them of the consequences, and equip them to make the correct choices.They know I expect them to treat women (of any faith) with respect, and have had opportunity to mix with the opposite gender from childhood.  They know I will never accept any excuses that begin with "but she was wearing..."  I've talked about alcohol.  How it will make them feel GOOD. -(don't lie about this to your kids) and how addiction works, and how even a little alcohol can affect your decision making process.

Parents TALK TO YOUR KIDS.  Also, perhaps their can be teen programs at the mosques to address these things.  Of course it will not always help.  There are always those who are defiant, or make mistakes, or just need to learn things the hard way.  But I am sure overall it can have positive results.

There should also be premarital classes on marriage.  NOT TO TEACH WOMEN HOW TO COOK FOR THEIR MEN- but how to ask the right questions regarding compatibility....seperating needs, from wants.  It should not be about "winning" a husband.  This is a decision you have to live with for a long time.  If you are a woman who does not want a traditional lifestyle, you need to find a man who is comfortable with that.  The classes should be about finding a compatible person- not telling people how they should be.

mama Grace
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10 years ago  ::  Jan 02, 2008 - 11:41AM #42
sazaj36
Posts: 331
"Also, perhaps their can be teen programs at the mosques to address these things."

Good luck getting Imams etc to discuss the possibility of Muslim teens engaging in any kind of immoral behavoir...they dont want to go there....if you dont talk about it....then it wont happen...or so  they believe(generally). Unfortunately I  think Muslim teens have to learn that stuff either at home...at school...or somewhere not related to the Mosque life. The muslim tendency to not discuss potential problems or even existing problems is wide spread and very deeply ingrained....the culture of shame keeps everyone tight lipped...except when it comes to pointing fingers at the nonmuslim communities...then its a free for all..
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10 years ago  ::  Jan 02, 2008 - 12:54PM #43
Atsila
Posts: 207
[QUOTE=magi_77;180332]I stand by my statements and haven't said anything that can't be backed by historical fact or current events (especially for Europe).  I am not a fan of politically correct history, if it is politically correct, its not history, its a lie.  .[/QUOTE]

I guess you aren't talking to me, but I wanted to say that I agree.
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10 years ago  ::  Jan 02, 2008 - 1:00PM #44
Atsila
Posts: 207
[QUOTE=Miraj;180139]What I want to see is women and men of like mind standing up against double standards, self-serving interpretations and cultural tyranny in their ummahs. If few do, what will things be like in 5 years, 10 years?

Salaam[/QUOTE]

I don't know; I guess even more splintered than it is now.  I just see people going their own way and not knowing who to 'hook up' with, because they don't have anywhere to go.  And I don't mean just for finding a marriage partner.  I'm talking about finding friends period where you have the same views, can meet and discuss issues, etc.  I think in order for us to 'fight' unislamic ideals, we have to be able to come together and that hasn't happened yet.  Until then, people will either be on their own or just not getting themselves involved.  It seems to be kind of a catch 22.

wassalam
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10 years ago  ::  Jan 02, 2008 - 8:24PM #45
Faqir
Posts: 238
However, as I see it, there's little motivation to find ways to bring men and women together because an "old World" mentality is running the primary institutions. Most Muslims who disagree are reluctant to attempt change, prefering to stay away.

Yes, this is certainly another major problem and one that a lot of people have closed their eyes and ears to. Young people tend not to go to the masjid except for ramadan, id, and sometimes jumma. If you don't believe me look around some day. These are not nonreligious individuals I am talking about either, they are people who firmly and deeply believe, but they find masjids, msa's, etc very uninviting and unfulfilling. One day we are going to wake up and the old guard is going to be gone and there will be no one to replace them, except perhaps the extremists and no one wants to imagine a future like that.

Most muslims are reluctant to attempt change, but there is little choice. Either we choose to make changes or we choose to let these institutions die a slow, painful, and expensive death with nothing to replace them. I have been in the back of my mind planning things I want to do in the next muslim community that I will be part of (I am intending on moving in about 6 months) based on the good things I have seen in certain communities as well as things I have heard from others. The biggest thing is that we have to make masjids etc places for things other than just hyper-religious activities. Eating, joking, and having fun really are acceptable activities. They also must not ever be places for criticizing each other. Muslims need to learn to love each other, because all I see in muslim communities is a lack of love.

I know that is a major digression from the point of this thread, but I thought it needed to be expressed.
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10 years ago  ::  Jan 02, 2008 - 9:57PM #46
USMuslim
Posts: 167
[QUOTE=Faqir;182721]However, as I see it, there's little motivation to find ways to bring men and women together because an "old World" mentality is running the primary institutions. Most Muslims who disagree are reluctant to attempt change, prefering to stay away.

Yes, this is certainly another major problem and one that a lot of people have closed their eyes and ears to. Young people tend not to go to the masjid except for ramadan, id, and sometimes jumma. If you don't believe me look around some day. These are not nonreligious individuals I am talking about either, they are people who firmly and deeply believe, but they find masjids, msa's, etc very uninviting and unfulfilling. One day we are going to wake up and the old guard is going to be gone and there will be no one to replace them, except perhaps the extremists and no one wants to imagine a future like that.

Most muslims are reluctant to attempt change, but there is little choice. Either we choose to make changes or we choose to let these institutions die a slow, painful, and expensive death with nothing to replace them. I have been in the back of my mind planning things I want to do in the next muslim community that I will be part of (I am intending on moving in about 6 months) based on the good things I have seen in certain communities as well as things I have heard from others. The biggest thing is that we have to make masjids etc places for things other than just hyper-religious activities. Eating, joking, and having fun really are acceptable activities. They also must not ever be places for criticizing each other. Muslims need to learn to love each other, because all I see in muslim communities is a lack of love.

I know that is a major digression from the point of this thread, but I thought it needed to be expressed.[/QUOTE]

I could not agree with you more! And you have just the right attitude toward making things better.

Check into the ADAMS Center in Sterling, VA if you want to see a lively, loving and active community, (look up their calendar at www.adamscenter.org) They are a great example of a dynamic Muslim community. You can drive by that mosque any evening and the building is lit up, top to bottom with people actually doing things, from traditional tafseer to  Scouting (Boys and Girl Scouts, all levels) to Toastmasters to karate for men and women. Women are on the board, there are regular elections and the community is pretty diverse, although because of it's proximity to Reston, there are lots of techie South Asian folks. But their pockets are deep for the community, Muslim and non-Muslim.
We had to leave the area last year, but my family's heart is still there with those good folks.
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10 years ago  ::  Jan 03, 2008 - 10:27AM #47
endgame
Posts: 122
[QUOTE=Faqir;182721]However, as I see it, there's little motivation to find ways to bring men and women together because an "old World" mentality is running the primary institutions. Most Muslims who disagree are reluctant to attempt change, prefering to stay away.

Yes, this is certainly another major problem and one that a lot of people have closed their eyes and ears to. Young people tend not to go to the masjid except for ramadan, id, and sometimes jumma. If you don't believe me look around some day. These are not nonreligious individuals I am talking about either, they are people who firmly and deeply believe, but they find masjids, msa's, etc very uninviting and unfulfilling. One day we are going to wake up and the old guard is going to be gone and there will be no one to replace them, except perhaps the extremists and no one wants to imagine a future like that.[/QUOTE]

Asalaamualaikum,

You are definitely describing me bro and how I feel about the whole thing. I have to look within myself and step up to the plate. I should stop being burnt and do something about it.
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10 years ago  ::  Jan 06, 2008 - 2:39AM #48
Mnizam
Posts: 1
To magi77:

This is my first post here. Im a muslim and my parents always taught me to treat others the way i want them to treat me. Live life in such a way that when non-muslims see me, they admire islam. There are many non-muslims who read posts on this site. Just imagine the type of opinion they get of Islam when they read comments like the one you made. And we wonder why the world has such negative opinions on Islam.

Salams..
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10 years ago  ::  Jan 07, 2008 - 1:58AM #49
sazaj36
Posts: 331
"Accordingly, i can safely say that your a Brain dead jack ass who needs to be skinned alive by all true muslims.".....could you please be a little more specific...cause we got a few of those in here....lol.

btw...welcome to the fray!
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10 years ago  ::  Jan 07, 2008 - 2:42AM #50
magi_77
Posts: 32

Mnizam wrote:

To magi77:

This is my first post here. Im a muslim and my parents always taught me to treat others the way i want them to treat me. Live life in such a way that when non-muslims see me, they admire islam. There are many non-muslims who read posts on this site. Just imagine the type of opinion they get of Islam when they read comments like the one you made. And we wonder why the world has such negative opinions on Islam.

Salams..



So when non-muslims see you, do you expect them to have never read the Quran? It sounds like a carefully veiled reference to the Pact of Umar. Admiring Islam only through the actions of men is a slippery slope I would rather not persue. There is nothing in my posts that can't be backed up by the historical record and they're very mild in comparison to what is already in printed material. History is never pretty, in fact, its down right brutal, if you can't stomach the ability to learn about the good, the bad, and the ugly, about any topic, then may be you should find another subject. When you say 'true muslims', do you really mean jihadists? The Taliban are known to have skinned captives alive you know. I seriously doubt I am the reason for negative opinions on Islam, Muslims themselves bear that burden, and calling for a Jihad against me isn't helping you make your case with the golden rule either.

wa `alaykum as-salām

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