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Switch to Forum Live View Islams teachings are valid all over the world
2 years ago  ::  Jun 26, 2012 - 2:18PM #1
sallum
Posts: 551

I challenge here to bring any “invalid”  of Islamic teaches.


The Holy Quran is “live” and is ruling the mankind life since revealed and all along.


Example;


Holy Qura        30:41 (Picktall) Corruption doth appear on land and sea because of (the evil) which men's hands have done, that He may make them taste a part of that which they have done, in order that they may return.


-
Who doesn’t recognize these corruptions? Who Told the Prophet Mohammed SAW about?


 


A testing sea ground for the deadly terrible bombs, the sinking of oil tankers, wars on sea and on land,… you name it.


 Everyone does see the result of corruption, into the oceans and land.


 At each act and time and at what will happen in the future that would make men taste a part of which they have done in order that they (we) may return.


 This verse is valid for each event of corruption no doubt. Each in it’s and later time and spot all over the earth and is valid when ever man’s hand will do corrupt.


 This is touching the convicted and victims of men and   they all tested, is testing, and will test the result.


 And we all witness this aren’t we?


 Sorry I am repeating myself in order to help my writing.


 The Verse is with us more than any other reporter with the events.


Back to the challege, what more can be powered than the challenge.


Valid teaches from 1433 years, 7 months and 6 days  ago and forever. Will then people take It.?


sallum

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 26, 2012 - 4:57PM #2
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 16,001

Sallum


Calm down.


Since you are on the DI board, I do not think you will find a lot of people saying that there are no valid teachings in Islam.


Since there are many bad things which happen in the world, I do not think you will find a lot of people saying that "all is for the best in this best of all possible worlds."


Why are you itching for a fight?


I would think that "baiting the bear" would be un-Islamic. No?

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 27, 2012 - 5:22PM #3
chevy956
Posts: 1,960

Jun 26, 2012 -- 2:18PM, sallum wrote:

I challenge here to bring any “invalid”  of Islamic teaches.


The Holy Quran is “live” and is ruling the mankind life since revealed and all along.


Example;


Holy Qura        30:41 (Picktall) Corruption doth appear on land and sea because of (the evil) which men's hands have done, that He may make them taste a part of that which they have done, in order that they may return.


-
Who doesn’t recognize these corruptions? Who Told the Prophet Mohammed SAW about?


 


A testing sea ground for the deadly terrible bombs, the sinking of oil tankers, wars on sea and on land,… you name it.


 Everyone does see the result of corruption, into the oceans and land.


 At each act and time and at what will happen in the future that would make men taste a part of which they have done in order that they (we) may return.


 This verse is valid for each event of corruption no doubt. Each in it’s and later time and spot all over the earth and is valid when ever man’s hand will do corrupt.


 This is touching the convicted and victims of men and   they all tested, is testing, and will test the result.


 And we all witness this aren’t we?


 Sorry I am repeating myself in order to help my writing.


 The Verse is with us more than any other reporter with the events.


Back to the challege, what more can be powered than the challenge.


Valid teaches from 1433 years, 7 months and 6 days  ago and forever. Will then people take It.?


sallum


You have no objective evidence for the existence of your god, much less any claims to authority derived from some alleged prophet whose sole source of authority is " God told me to write this". You don't even have the original Quran, but one cobbled together from a bunch of different versions. 


 There isn't anything in Islam that couldn't be dismissed by a 6th grader with a Western education and reasonable intelligence.

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 28, 2012 - 7:08AM #4
Ibn
Posts: 4,832

Jun 27, 2012 -- 5:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

You have no objective evidence for the existence of your god...


Existence of heavens and earth, and all that is between them is objective evidence of uncreated Creator we call Allah, G-d, God. This is so because nothing can be created out of nothing and nothing can't create anything. 


Jun 27, 2012 -- 5:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

...much less any claims to authority derived from some alleged prophet whose sole source of authority is " God told me to write this".


That is called "faith". It is done in good faith. Don't you ever do anything in good faith? 


Jun 27, 2012 -- 5:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

You don't even have the original Quran, but one cobbled together from a bunch of different versions.


 The original Qur'an was in spoken words. It was then written down and memorized at the same time by those who were with the messenger (pbuh). What is your objective evidence for "a bunch of different versions"?


 

Jun 27, 2012 -- 5:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

There isn't anything in Islam that couldn't be dismissed by a 6th grader with a Western education and reasonable intelligence.


Nonsense, when there are today many graduates (passed well beyond 6th grade) of "Western education" who are Muslims in Islam.


If I tell my 2 year old grandson all about Islam the chances are that he will dismiss it because he won't understand it properly. Many graduates, many of them even with science degrees, have not only not dismissed Islam but have become Islam scholars. My two daughters have graduated through "Western education" and are themselves educators by profession in the Western education system. They firmly believe in Islam. Their faith was consolidated not at home but whilist they were at their respective universties. 

I know one thing: There are a billion Islamic people in the world today, and there will be about 2 billion by the time we're dead. They're not going to give up their religion.
(Chris Matthews)
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 30, 2012 - 2:52PM #5
sallum
Posts: 551

Jun 27, 2012 -- 5:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

Jun 26, 2012 -- 2:18PM, sallum wrote:


I challenge here to bring any “invalid”  of Islamic teaches.


The Holy Quran is “live” and is ruling the mankind life since revealed and all along.


Example;


Holy Qura        30:41 (Picktall) Corruption doth appear on land and sea because of (the evil) which men's hands have done, that He may make them taste a part of that which they have done, in order that they may return.


-
Who doesn’t recognize these corruptions? Who Told the Prophet Mohammed SAW about?


 


A testing sea ground for the deadly terrible bombs, the sinking of oil tankers, wars on sea and on land,… you name it.


 Everyone does see the result of corruption, into the oceans and land.


 At each act and time and at what will happen in the future that would make men taste a part of which they have done in order that they (we) may return.


 This verse is valid for each event of corruption no doubt. Each in it’s and later time and spot all over the earth and is valid when ever man’s hand will do corrupt.


 This is touching the convicted and victims of men and   they all tested, is testing, and will test the result.


 And we all witness this aren’t we?


 Sorry I am repeating myself in order to help my writing.


 The Verse is with us more than any other reporter with the events.


Back to the challege, what more can be powered than the challenge.


Valid teaches from 1433 years, 7 months and 6 days  ago and forever. Will then people take It.?


sallum




You have no objective evidence for the existence of your god, much less any claims to authority derived from some alleged prophet whose sole source of authority is " God told me to write this". You don't even have the original Quran, but one cobbled together from a bunch of different versions. 


 There isn't anything in Islam that couldn't be dismissed by a 6th grader with a Western education and reasonable intelligence.






Let me give you an example you may understand…


If you came home  - no one live in but you- and find your dining  table full of food you like and drinks you like, and lights you need and chairs you set with


Wouldn’t you ask yourself who did this for you? Or you sit  and enjoy the meal or your panic ,…  and then you go to sleep.


 


You did not bring yourself to earth, you suddenly existed there, as the earth is much much older than man,..


The time you existed you find all the benefits you need and more,  you light with the sun and Moon, see if you can see a single thing without those lighter.! Creatures which live in darkness like caves and deep water them lose their eyes as they do not need them with darkness. See if you live with no eyes?  See who gave you those eyes. Who fit them with the light and how it fitting the Vision Optical…… the light and the eye’s elements.   


Does this need a proof of Maker?  FITTING

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2 years ago  ::  Jul 01, 2012 - 1:13PM #6
sallum
Posts: 551

Jun 27, 2012 -- 5:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

Jun 26, 2012 -- 2:18PM, sallum wrote:

I challenge here to bring any “invalid”  of Islamic teaches.


The Holy Quran is “live” and is ruling the mankind life since revealed and all along.


Example;


Holy Qura        30:41 (Picktall) Corruption doth appear on land and sea because of (the evil) which men's hands have done, that He may make them taste a part of that which they have done, in order that they may return.


-
Who doesn’t recognize these corruptions? Who Told the Prophet Mohammed SAW about?


 


A testing sea ground for the deadly terrible bombs, the sinking of oil tankers, wars on sea and on land,… you name it.


 Everyone does see the result of corruption, into the oceans and land.


 At each act and time and at what will happen in the future that would make men taste a part of which they have done in order that they (we) may return.


 This verse is valid for each event of corruption no doubt. Each in it’s and later time and spot all over the earth and is valid when ever man’s hand will do corrupt.


 This is touching the convicted and victims of men and   they all tested, is testing, and will test the result.


 And we all witness this aren’t we?


 Sorry I am repeating myself in order to help my writing.


 The Verse is with us more than any other reporter with the events.


Back to the challege, what more can be powered than the challenge.


Valid teaches from 1433 years, 7 months and 6 days  ago and forever. Will then people take It.?


sallum


You have no objective evidence for the existence of your god, much less any claims to authority derived from some alleged prophet whose sole source of authority is " God told me to write this". You don't even have the original Quran, but one cobbled together from a bunch of different versions. 


 There isn't anything in Islam that couldn't be dismissed by a 6th grader with a Western education and reasonable intelligence.


 


You do not know the story of revealed but you do relive the story.


The story is a man was thinking about creatures how they act and achieve including planets and bringing them to the tells he hear from here and there and he walked away to a mountain just to help himself to think clearly.


He did not know that he has been chosen to hold a message, He as a human being. And not as a robot or something,  and that what started.


Since the message is “manual book” of human beings beliefs and achieves to be activate and to remove all what is wrong as to be followed as much as can be.


This individual mission has to have all kind of successful to start and then to continue and to spread all over the world.


The Messenger started to receive the message, and to understand the mission he is with and it is with the primer Verses;


96:1 (Picktall) Read: In the name of thy Lord


96:1 (Y. Ali) Proclaim! (or read!) in the name of thy Lord and Cherisher, Who created- who createth,


-   96:1 (Asad)READ
html_removed
[1] in the name of thy Sustainer, who has-


And give yourself a permission to read the whole Surah 96 alaq.


Know let us use our minds,….


How can this message be delivered to the man @ the top of a mountain? And HE doesn’t able to read nor to write.


It is from unseen and should have the image of the sender (unseen) and that it is.


The delivery “person” is also from the unseen,


So the message is from the unseen and the delivery person is from the unseen and the message is unseen as well, that I guess is well fair.


The receiver is from real and the takers are from the real and reciting is from the real, also I guess this is well fair.


The matter is to believe with the Unseen by telling the reveals.


The proof and power of the reveals is specific with its reality from idealism way, this Idealism is with the chosen subject, words, and occasions,


Since the Message is “manual Book” of human beings it must tough the reality, reality is point to point action of living,… and that was the revealed steps from action to another through 23 years of live.


Also incredible stories were involved to help the minds to take the idealism of Man’s life.


Top topic of the message is to interview the sender. (The Lord).


Second topic is to know what HE wants.


Third topic is how to recruit above knowledge to run the straight manners.


Forth topic is to live with these intelligent forward the progress and spread up all over the earth safely and positively as much as can be.


Fifth topic is to deal with these intelligent and Beliefs as a Challenge “ a test”.


Sixth topic is to understand that there will be rewards and punishments.


Seventh topic is the meeting of the Lord and His slaves for eternal life - heaven/hell.


The moral of the Message is:


 Man is a sort and not individual creature @ first and hereafter life.


The individuality is @ which part of this structure (sort) belonging.


The structure is with top med below foundation.


With all above topics the most perfect fitful way to start the message is by reveal it directly to the Hearts till the time suit enough to put the Message in writing out from these Hearts  these hearts were the most safe place ever and ever. No corruption. One heart confirms the other and the strange one were completely ignored.


 That was with the efforts of the prophet Mohammed SAW and his companions and the followers.


That all was planed and protected by the Sender, Our Lord, Allah Almighty.


This is the structure in small brief. All what you need is to make up your mind and dig.


sallum

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2 years ago  ::  Jul 01, 2012 - 4:22PM #7
chevy956
Posts: 1,960

Jun 30, 2012 -- 2:52PM, sallum wrote:

Jun 27, 2012 -- 5:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

Jun 26, 2012 -- 2:18PM, sallum wrote:


I challenge here to bring any “invalid”  of Islamic teaches.


The Holy Quran is “live” and is ruling the mankind life since revealed and all along.


Example;


Holy Qura        30:41 (Picktall) Corruption doth appear on land and sea because of (the evil) which men's hands have done, that He may make them taste a part of that which they have done, in order that they may return.


-
Who doesn’t recognize these corruptions? Who Told the Prophet Mohammed SAW about?


 


A testing sea ground for the deadly terrible bombs, the sinking of oil tankers, wars on sea and on land,… you name it.


 Everyone does see the result of corruption, into the oceans and land.


 At each act and time and at what will happen in the future that would make men taste a part of which they have done in order that they (we) may return.


 This verse is valid for each event of corruption no doubt. Each in it’s and later time and spot all over the earth and is valid when ever man’s hand will do corrupt.


 This is touching the convicted and victims of men and   they all tested, is testing, and will test the result.


 And we all witness this aren’t we?


 Sorry I am repeating myself in order to help my writing.


 The Verse is with us more than any other reporter with the events.


Back to the challege, what more can be powered than the challenge.


Valid teaches from 1433 years, 7 months and 6 days  ago and forever. Will then people take It.?


sallum




You have no objective evidence for the existence of your god, much less any claims to authority derived from some alleged prophet whose sole source of authority is " God told me to write this". You don't even have the original Quran, but one cobbled together from a bunch of different versions. 


 There isn't anything in Islam that couldn't be dismissed by a 6th grader with a Western education and reasonable intelligence.






Let me give you an example you may understand…


If you came home  - no one live in but you- and find your dining  table full of food you like and drinks you like, and lights you need and chairs you set with


Wouldn’t you ask yourself who did this for you? Or you sit  and enjoy the meal or your panic ,…  and then you go to sleep.


 


You did not bring yourself to earth, you suddenly existed there, as the earth is much much older than man,..


The time you existed you find all the benefits you need and more,  you light with the sun and Moon, see if you can see a single thing without those lighter.! Creatures which live in darkness like caves and deep water them lose their eyes as they do not need them with darkness. See if you live with no eyes?  See who gave you those eyes. Who fit them with the light and how it fitting the Vision Optical…… the light and the eye’s elements.   


Does this need a proof of Maker?  FITTING


Argument by analogy doesn't constitute objective evidence. Try again.

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2 years ago  ::  Jul 02, 2012 - 1:52PM #8
sallum
Posts: 551

Jul 1, 2012 -- 4:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

Jun 30, 2012 -- 2:52PM, sallum wrote:


Jun 27, 2012 -- 5:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

Jun 26, 2012 -- 2:18PM, sallum wrote:


I challenge here to bring any “invalid”  of Islamic teaches.


The Holy Quran is “live” and is ruling the mankind life since revealed and all along.


Example;


Holy Qura        30:41 (Picktall) Corruption doth appear on land and sea because of (the evil) which men's hands have done, that He may make them taste a part of that which they have done, in order that they may return.


-
 Argument by analogy doesn't constitute objective evidence. Try again.




------]


Please tell me one of the objective evidence to constitute the matter.



Or maybe you want one of these objectives;



 ** First you have to know that Muslims do understand quite enough this matter;



17:89 (Picktall) And verily We have displayed for mankind in this Qur'an all kinds of similitudes, but most of mankind refuse aught save disbelief.



And here are the optional objectives try one or maybe all;



17:90 (Picktall) And they say: We will not put faith in thee till thou cause a spring to gush forth from the earth for us;



17:91 (Picktall) Or thou have a garden of date palms and grapes, and cause rivers to gush forth therein abundantly;



 17:92 "Or thou cause the sky to fall in pieces, as thou sayest (will happen), against us; or thou bring Allah and the angels before (us) face to face:



17:93 (Picktall) Thou have a house of gold; or thou ascend up into heaven, and even then we will put no faith in thine ascension till thou bring down for us a book that we can read. Say (O Muhammad): My Lord be glorified! Am I naught save a mortal messenger? -   



 sallum

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2 years ago  ::  Jul 04, 2012 - 11:06AM #9
chevy956
Posts: 1,960

Jul 2, 2012 -- 1:52PM, sallum wrote:

Jul 1, 2012 -- 4:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

Jun 30, 2012 -- 2:52PM, sallum wrote:


Jun 27, 2012 -- 5:22PM, chevy956 wrote:

Jun 26, 2012 -- 2:18PM, sallum wrote:


I challenge here to bring any “invalid”  of Islamic teaches.


The Holy Quran is “live” and is ruling the mankind life since revealed and all along.


Example;


Holy Qura        30:41 (Picktall) Corruption doth appear on land and sea because of (the evil) which men's hands have done, that He may make them taste a part of that which they have done, in order that they may return.


-
 Argument by analogy doesn't constitute objective evidence. Try again.




------]


Please tell me one of the objective evidence to constitute the matter.



Or maybe you want one of these objectives;



 ** First you have to know that Muslims do understand quite enough this matter;



17:89 (Picktall) And verily We have displayed for mankind in this Qur'an all kinds of similitudes, but most of mankind refuse aught save disbelief.



And here are the optional objectives try one or maybe all;



17:90 (Picktall) And they say: We will not put faith in thee till thou cause a spring to gush forth from the earth for us;



17:91 (Picktall) Or thou have a garden of date palms and grapes, and cause rivers to gush forth therein abundantly;



 17:92 "Or thou cause the sky to fall in pieces, as thou sayest (will happen), against us; or thou bring Allah and the angels before (us) face to face:



17:93 (Picktall) Thou have a house of gold; or thou ascend up into heaven, and even then we will put no faith in thine ascension till thou bring down for us a book that we can read. Say (O Muhammad): My Lord be glorified! Am I naught save a mortal messenger? -   



 sallum


What you have are any number of baseless claims. That isn't evidence. Its a book compiled by a number of humans. Claims made without evidence get dismissed with evidence.

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2 years ago  ::  Jul 04, 2012 - 1:47PM #10
chevy956
Posts: 1,960

I'm looking for testable, objective, verifiable evidence that your God exists outside of someone's imagination , first off. Without that your claims that the supposedly divenly revealed Quran is universally appicable to all is simply nonsense to be discarded without a second thought. Your claims aren't immune from the rules of logic and evidence because they are in an allegedly 'holy" book. You made the initial claim. The burden of proof is on you, not me,


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