Jun 14, 2012 -- 11:12PM, teilhard wrote:

My own Experience of The Reality of The Mystery we call "God" is sufficient for ME, but of course a "vicarious" such Experience is not available in any Store ...

So I guess you'll just have to keep shoppin' around -- or not ...

If you have had an Experience that shows your god really exists, then go right ahead an give your experience and explain why this experience makes you feel your god actually does exist.  You have been asked to do this numerous times, and you have always refused to do so.  If you won't do this, it makes it appear that you are just throwing out more worthless bullshit. 

Jun 14, 2012 -- 11:37PM, teilhard wrote:

Well, then ... If you're NOT genuinely interested in pursuing The "God" Question seriously personally, then why do you keep asking about "God" ... ???

I dunno ...

Bill ...

Relax ... Take a couple deep Breaths ...

I've never asked you the "God" question, I've just have asked you to show your God does actually exist.  Maybe after you do this, I'll ask you some God question, but until then, there is little point in asking them.

Jun 14, 2012 -- 11:59PM, teilhard wrote:

***Patiently ... for the several-teenth Time***

Bill ...

I have never CLAIMED that I CAN "show" you "God" ... 

I know you never claimed you could.  And, you have never provided anything to back up you claim that your silly god does actually exist.  You have just said "He does, he does, he does" like a little kid.  I can say the same thing about the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus, and almost any other imaginary being. 

Jun 14, 2012 -- 11:59PM, teilhard wrote:

IF you would ever be truly seriously personally interested in seeking "God" you will need to do so SERIOUSLY, which will require that you abandon your obvious Hostility toward "God" ...

Why would I be interested is seeking "God"???  That would really be dumb.  I don't go around seeking imaginary characters that only exist in peoples imagination.  Why should I SERIOUSLY seek God, when he doesn't even exist??  Dumb, dumb, dumb!   That's about the dumest idea I've ever heard of. 

What "obvious Hostility toward God"??  Why would I be hostile to something that doesn't exist, like Peter Pan, Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy and many other things like this that only exist in peoples imagination??   

I don't worry about "Atheists,"

Strange remark for an Atheist groupie to make.

Jun 11, 2012 -- 6:37PM, steven_guy wrote:

I saw the link to this on Facebook. It may be of interest to members of this forum, particularly for a couple of the theists whose faith seems to have been in crisis for some years now.

www.alternet.org/belief/155798/major_thr... 

This is hardly earthshaking.

1. People of faith may have doubts or give up on faith altogether. That fact that a person is in a pastoral position when it happens is not actually relevant. The question is, what steps does any specific person (individual follower or leader) take when they have doubts? Church is about supporting one another in our faith journeys. We are not islands. A lot of people have found their faith stengthened by going through this tempering process and coming out on the other side with a clearer thought and understanding about God. I know I have. And a lot of times it has been because someone was there to help me gain a clearer view of God. And for my part, I try to help others when asked because, well, I know what it's like to feel lost and discouraged, and I don't want them to feel like there aren't any helpful answers or supportive friends.

2. If someone loses faith solely because their pastor loses faith, then I would suggest that that person may never have actually made their faith their own, but was simply relying on someone else's efforts. That would be very simiular to someone who gets through school by borrowing the homework and study notes of their friends rather than trying to develop an honest understanding of the subject material themselves. Every believing person needs to do their own work when attempting to establish their faith in God.

3. I am glad to see that the pastors who have lost their faith now have a support group to help one another during this new stage in their lives. But, once again, it is not necessarily a given that because some pastors have lost their faith means that a majority or all pastors are in a similar state of mind. Non-belevers reading about these pastors' experiences recognize this particular state of mind because many of them have gone through similar experiences and thought processes. But hoping that this new public appearance of pastoral doubt means that it will soon become a tsunami of doubt is simply projecting their hopes and their own experiences on the population as a whole IMO.