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Switch to Forum Live View Spin off thread discussion - 2000 or 1975?
2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:17PM #1
Newtonian
Posts: 12,187
OK, I am trying to see how understandingtruth could have been associated with Jehovah's Witnesses and still post that we believed things we never believed - note I never said 'he' was lying.


Now, since this involves not just since the 1990's, but also the 1960's and the interim - I have brainstormed a possible solution. 


But I need understandingtruth to confirm.   Was it the year 2000 or the year 1975 that you were referring to in your posts????


While we were never dogmatic about 1975, some of us believed Armageddon might come by then and were, indeed, disappointed.   My congregation took this in a balanced way, knowing, as Paul stated: "the time left is reduced" - but not knowing how much time was left.


And, if any of you have a sense of humor like I do - I find this verse humorous - it is, in fact, a mathematical certainty!Surprised  And....Surprised

(1 Corinthians 7:29) Moreover, this I say, brothers, the time left is reduced. Henceforth let those who have wives be as though they had none, SurprisedSurprised
            
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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:41PM #2
AnnOMaly
Posts: 3,231

some of us believed



Uuuarghh! Not again.


The belief came from the top leadership and was disseminated through the ranks. Those who didn't believe  - if it became known - were treated as if they lacked faith.

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:44PM #3
woodzz
Posts: 2,065

It's probably all those quotes about the work being completed by the end of the 20th century.  I was just reading about this.  I'll try to find the quotes. 


 


Woodzz

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:46PM #4
Kemmer
Posts: 16,553

If Jesus supposedly OK'd the JW books in 1914-18 as "food at the proper time", it would seem  that "food" would certainly cause spiritual botulism today.  Tongue Out

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:48PM #5
Newtonian
Posts: 12,187

May 31, 2012 -- 6:41PM, AnnOMaly wrote:


some of us believed



Uuuarghh! Not again.


The belief came from the top leadership and disseminated through the ranks. 




What belief?   2000 or 1975?   Did you understand why understanding truth posted as 'he' did?


BTW - We have had other wrong expectations - Jesus foretold this for his faithful followers - Jesus will come at an hour we do not think to be it:


(Matthew 24:44) On this account YOU too prove yourselves ready, because at an hour that YOU do not think to be it, the Son of man is coming.


Do you agree Jesus was addressing his faithful followers in this verse?


Compare the apostles and disciples having both the timing and which Israel wrong in this leading question:


(Acts 1:6) . . .When, now, they had assembled, they went asking him: “Lord, are you restoring the kingdom to Israel at this time?. . .




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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:54PM #6
Newtonian
Posts: 12,187

May 31, 2012 -- 6:46PM, Kemmer wrote:


If Jesus supposedly OK'd the JW books in 1914-18 as "food at the proper time", it would seem  that "food" would certainly cause spiritual botulism today.  Tongue Out




Kemmer - Jesus did not immediately correct his followers in 33 CE when they got both the timing and which Israel wrong.   Yet they were approved as Jesus' faithful slave, were they not?


More important - which Israel was corrrect?


(Acts 1:6) . . .When, now, they had assembled, they went asking him: “Lord, are you restoring the kingdom to Israel at this time?. . .

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:56PM #7
woodzz
Posts: 2,065

1971 "The Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah" p.216 #9


"Shortly, within our twentieth century, the 'battle in the day of Jehovah' will begin against the modern antitype of Jerusalem, Christendom."


 


Woodzz

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 7:03PM #8
woodzz
Posts: 2,065

May 31, 2012 -- 6:54PM, Newtonian wrote:


May 31, 2012 -- 6:46PM, Kemmer wrote:


If Jesus supposedly OK'd the JW books in 1914-18 as "food at the proper time", it would seem  that "food" would certainly cause spiritual botulism today.  Tongue Out




Kemmer - Jesus did not immediately correct his followers in 33 CE when they got both the timing and which Israel wrong.   Yet they were approved as Jesus' faithful slave, were they not?


More important - which Israel was corrrect?


(Acts 1:6) . . .When, now, they had assembled, they went asking him: “Lord, are you restoring the kingdom to Israel at this time?. . .





If that excuses the WT Org's false teachings during their inspection then it excuses everyone's, or you'll need to rewrite your interpretation of Matthew 24:45 to read that he didn't find the slave class either faithful nor wise but appointed them anyway and threw out all the food they'd been serving because it was not the right sort of food at the proper time, certainly wasn't revealed by God from his word, but was the opinions of men based on their limited wisdom.


But the WT Org itself sets out the standards Jesus would have applied and they failed every one of them.


Woodzz

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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 7:08PM #9
woodzz
Posts: 2,065

Watch Tower 10/15/1980 QFR p.31 (in it's entirety) (look for "turn of the century" in the article)


Questions From Readers


In speaking of “the sign of [his] presence and of the conclusion of the system of things,” Jesus said to his disciples: “Truly I say to you that this generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur.” (Matt. 24:3, 34) How are we to understand this?


This prophecy, uttered in the year 33 C.E., had a notable typical fulfillment up until the year 70 C.E., when the Jewish system of things was destroyed, and Jerusalem’s temple was thrown down, ‘not a stone being left upon a stone.’ In Jerusalem alone 1,100,000 Jews perished, according to the historian Josephus. Although many of Jesus’ early disciples had died in the persecutions up until that time, some of the generation that had been with Jesus and had witnessed his mighty works remained also to see the end of that “conclusion of the system of things.” (Matt. 24:2, 3) They were persons of Jesus’ generation, his contemporaries.


However, from Jesus’ prophecy we understand that his words are to have a later, major fulfillment, culminating in “great tribulation such as has not occurred since the world’s beginning until now, no, nor will occur again.” This “great tribulation” is to embrace not just a Jewish “system of things” but the entire world of mankind, yes, “all the nations” to whom Jehovah’s Witnesses must ‘preach this good news of the kingdom before the end comes.’ The “pangs of distress” that began to afflict this earth, starting with World War I, show that Jesus’ “sign” is having its great antitypical fulfillment from 1914 onward.—Matt. 24:3-8, 14, 21.


What, then, is the “generation” that “will by no means pass away until all these things occur”? It does not refer to a period of time, which some have tried to interpret as 30, 40, 70 or even 120 years, but, rather, it refers to people, the people living at the “beginning of pangs of distress” for this condemned world system. It is the generation of people who saw the catastrophic events that broke forth in connection with World War I from 1914 onward.


As indicated by an article on page 56 of U.S. News & World Report of January 14, 1980, “If you assume that 10 is the age at which an event creates a lasting impression on a person’s memory,” then there are today more than 13 million Americans who have a “recollection of World War I.” And if the wicked system of this world survived until the turn of the century, which is highly improbable in view of world trends and the fulfillment of Bible prophecy, there would still be survivors of the World War I generation. However, the fact that their number is dwindling is one more indication that “the conclusion of the system of things” is moving fast toward its end.


In this connection, the magazine The Economist of March 15, 1980, gave an interesting review of a book entitled “The Generation of 1914” by Robert Wohl. It made this significant remark: “Eventually Mr. Wohl voices his own opinions about the generation of 1914. In a terse and condensed last chapter he suggests that generations are not mathematically definable in terms of numbers of years, but cluster around major historical crises, of which the first world war is the supreme example.” This lines up very well with the Scriptural viewpoint that Jehovah’s Witnesses take on “the generation of 1914.”


Yes, there was a generation of people that was living in 1914, and that saw the major historical changes from an era of comparative tranquillity to the present era of war, lawlessness and ruination. Many who are now Jehovah’s Witnesses were among them. Truly, 1914 marked “the supreme example” of change, for that year set in motion the foretold “beginning of pangs of distress” among the nations. Many persons are still alive who can tell us how catastrophically conditions on earth changed in the year 1914. And the world continues to plunge into worse and worse trouble. We can be happy, therefore, for Jesus’ assurance that there will be survivors of “the generation of 1914”—that this generation will not have completely passed away—when the “great tribulation” rings down the curtain on this wicked world system.


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2 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 7:12PM #10
woodzz
Posts: 2,065

Here's another one that Understanding might be referring to:


WT 3/1/1984 p.18-19


Why do we say, Kingdom unity? Well, is not God’s Kingdom the theme of the entire Bible? So, then, should not the Kingdom be a unifying theme in our lives? It has been thrilling to see the fulfillment of Jesus’ sign showing that the Kingdom was established in the heavens in that momentous year 1914. And Jesus has told us to rejoice at seeing the dark storm clouds of Armageddon gathering since that time. He has told us that the “generation” of 1914—the year that the sign began to be fulfilled—”will by no means pass away until all these things occur.” (Matthew 24:34) Some of that “generation” could survive until the end of the century. But there are many indications that “the end” is much closer than that!


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