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Locked: God is ONE, and not three
3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:24PM #21
Utilyan
Posts: 6,101

All men are equal?     Jesus is a complete man.   Jesus equals to you.


 


 


All men are NOT equal?    Jesus is not equal to you.   But God paid him up for YOU.   If the money was better then what he was buying,  then why part with the money at all?


 


A cheeseburger might cost you a dollar.......   You part with your dollar saying the burger is better.


 


Maybe there is no equal to God,  he holds you in higher priority then himself.


 


Ask the man who loves everyone "who is greater?",   he swears everyone is greater then he is.


God's love is greater.

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3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:29PM #22
Adelphe
Posts: 28,744

May 31, 2012 -- 10:14AM, Eliyahu7 wrote:


May 31, 2012 -- 7:41AM, Adelphe wrote:


"God is ONE" what and "not three" whats?



Bs'd


Undefined, and therefore everything.



Eliyahu





Then why should that "everything" exclude the Trinity?

Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason, my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and I will not retract anything, for to go against conscience would be neither right nor safe.  Here I stand.  I can do no other.  God help me.  Amen.
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3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:37PM #23
Adelphe
Posts: 28,744

May 31, 2012 -- 10:16AM, Eliyahu7 wrote:


May 31, 2012 -- 9:10AM, 57 wrote:


Of course God is one.  I don't know of any Christian who would argue against that.


You problem is explaining why Jesus and the Holy Spirit are presented in the bible as doing things only God can do. 


Do you need some examples?




Bs'd


Every trinitarian will say that God is three.   Three persons.




Eliyahu





And why is that a problem?  English persons=Latin personas=Hebrew panim/panah=face(s).


What do you do with things like:


1.  "You cannot see my face, for man shall not see me and live."


2.  "Thus the LORD used to speak to Moses face to face, as a man speaks to his friend."


?

Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason, my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and I will not retract anything, for to go against conscience would be neither right nor safe.  Here I stand.  I can do no other.  God help me.  Amen.
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3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:40PM #24
Adelphe
Posts: 28,744

May 31, 2012 -- 10:19AM, 57 wrote:


May 31, 2012 -- 10:16AM, Eliyahu7 wrote:


May 31, 2012 -- 9:10AM, 57 wrote:


Of course God is one.  I don't know of any Christian who would argue against that.


You problem is explaining why Jesus and the Holy Spirit are presented in the bible as doing things only God can do. 


Do you need some examples?




Bs'd


Every trinitarian will say that God is three.   Three persons.




Eliyahu





Duh....and with very good reason.  


I noticed you danced around my question.


Here it is again ...


You problem is explaining why Jesus and the Holy Spirit are presented in the bible as doing things only God can do. 




Hello--Eliyahu?

Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason, my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and I will not retract anything, for to go against conscience would be neither right nor safe.  Here I stand.  I can do no other.  God help me.  Amen.
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3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:42PM #25
Adelphe
Posts: 28,744

May 31, 2012 -- 10:21AM, Blü wrote:


Adelphe


"God is ONE" what and "not three" whats?


God is one being, Yahweh, and not three beings, Yahweh, Jesus and Ghost.


What else could it mean?


Especially that long ago, before the Trinity was invented?




Not God=Yahweh, Jesus, and Ghost; God=Yahweh=Father, Son, & Holy Spirit.

Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason, my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and I will not retract anything, for to go against conscience would be neither right nor safe.  Here I stand.  I can do no other.  God help me.  Amen.
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3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:44PM #26
Adelphe
Posts: 28,744

May 31, 2012 -- 4:50PM, davelaw40 wrote:


May 31, 2012 -- 10:29AM, Blü wrote:


dave


but ONE GOD


there is ONE GOD


but the Father is GOD


the Spirit is GOD


and the Son is GOD


yet, one GOD


Not according to Jesus.  See the usual quotes (in my post before this one).




all the verses that show that Jesus voluntarily submitted to the Father




(How many times does this have to be said:  functional subordination, NOT ontological subordination.  Just like in "real" life:  a son is functionally subordinate to a father, NOT ontologically subordinate as if he is somehow less than human...)

Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason, my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and I will not retract anything, for to go against conscience would be neither right nor safe.  Here I stand.  I can do no other.  God help me.  Amen.
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3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:46PM #27
Adelphe
Posts: 28,744

May 31, 2012 -- 5:35PM, Utilyan wrote:


God let his son die for our sake.......that means God submits to us?  


 


God might count "one",  but its a differ kind of "one" from ours.    He's inclusive "US".


 


We can point at God's hand and ask who's hand is this?       He's going to tell you this hand belongs to my children.    We point at his heart.......This heart will always be yours.


Who am I to tell him he is wrong?   Is God a liar?


This bickering over the priority/dominance.......is insignificant to God.   We are relative sighted in fear-based confusion,   from egotistical flawed perspectives.


God can only be one, WITH YOU.......       A trinity is in there somewhere.




Some pearls in here...

Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason, my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and I will not retract anything, for to go against conscience would be neither right nor safe.  Here I stand.  I can do no other.  God help me.  Amen.
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3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:48PM #28
Adelphe
Posts: 28,744

May 31, 2012 -- 5:35PM, Miguel_de_servet wrote:

God is ONE ... God as opposed to many Gods, which was the common belief of most, if not all ME religions at the time when Deut 6:4 was written.



No, God is echad, not yachid--unique.  Especially in the context of Deut 6.



God is not three ... "co-equal, co-eternal persons".


MdS




Well not according to you, no.  He's 2 unequal divine persons with a floaty spirit force power thing.

Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason, my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and I will not retract anything, for to go against conscience would be neither right nor safe.  Here I stand.  I can do no other.  God help me.  Amen.
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3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 6:48PM #29
Adelphe
Posts: 28,744

May 31, 2012 -- 6:18PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


I always thought the Nicean doctrine of the Trinity was flawed theology, even before I left Christianity. 




It is pure perfection.

Unless I am convinced by Scripture and plain reason, my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and I will not retract anything, for to go against conscience would be neither right nor safe.  Here I stand.  I can do no other.  God help me.  Amen.
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3 years ago  ::  May 31, 2012 - 9:26PM #30
Blü
Posts: 25,269

Adelphe


Not God=Yahweh, Jesus, and Ghost; God=Yahweh=Father, Son, & Holy Spirit.


No, that was much later.  It's not in the NT.


And as the Catholic Encyclopedia says, the official status of the Trinity doctrine is a nonsense (or 'mystery' in their jargon).

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