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Switch to Forum Live View Why Theists Won't Think
2 years ago  ::  May 07, 2012 - 6:30PM #171
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

May 7, 2012 -- 6:22PM, steven_guy wrote:


May 7, 2012 -- 6:13PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


May 7, 2012 -- 5:54PM, Ken wrote:


May 7, 2012 -- 4:58PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

And in my short jaunts in and out of here, I have not heard any terribly origional, or even really unpredictable, ideas from you in particular or the atheist posters here in general.


Why on earth would you expect to hear original or unpredictable ideas? For my part, I take very little interest in the tawdry delights (such as they are) of intellectual novelty. It is often pretentious and usually wrong.




That's true, to a certain extent. Although I don't think my view is quite so dim as yours.


I guess my approach would be, one must carefully consider what might be a gem, as opposed to mere mental masturbation. 




What did you expect from atheists? The only thing we have in common is a lack of belief in god. Atheism doesn't shape my opinions about anything or influence my tastes in any way.




Of course it does. Your opinons in your posts reflect that regularly. Just as theism shapes my opinons.


Tastes? Perhaps not so much. I agree with you there.


But I wasn't talking in terms of tastes or opinions. I was talking in terms of ideas that might bolster atheism. I've not yet seen anything here particularly compelling in that regard. Just the same old stuff I've always seen. 


As can probably be said about most of the arguments on these boards coming from this side of the issue.


Oh well. 

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2 years ago  ::  May 07, 2012 - 6:33PM #172
Ken
Posts: 33,859

May 7, 2012 -- 6:30PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

But I wasn't talking in terms of tastes or opinions. I was talking in terms of ideas that might bolster atheism. I've not yet seen anything here particularly compelling in that regard. Just the same old stuff I've always seen.



But then you don't want to be an atheist.

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2 years ago  ::  May 07, 2012 - 6:46PM #173
steven_guy
Posts: 11,751

May 7, 2012 -- 6:30PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


Of course it does. Your opinons in your posts reflect that regularly. Just as theism shapes my opinons.





Don't YOU tell ME what shapes MY opinions, buster! I know who and what I am. You know SFA about me and my life.

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2 years ago  ::  May 07, 2012 - 6:51PM #174
Thetwofish
Posts: 581

myt: I was talking in terms of ideas that might bolster atheism.


Like, what, for instance?  I wasn't aware, at least as far as I've seen here, that atheists want to or feel the need to offer up ideas to "bolster" atheism.


I have come to the dinstinct conclusion that atheists don't give a care in the world whether any theists want to "join their side", therefore, why would they even offer ideas that would "bolster" their non-belief?


If I'm off the mark, please atheists, correct me.


Peace


<'{{><

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2 years ago  ::  May 07, 2012 - 7:15PM #175
Ken
Posts: 33,859

May 7, 2012 -- 6:51PM, Thetwofish wrote:


myt: I was talking in terms of ideas that might bolster atheism.


Like, what, for instance?  I wasn't aware, at least as far as I've seen here, that atheists want to or feel the need to offer up ideas to "bolster" atheism.


We don't. We'd like to see theists offer up some new ideas to bolster theism, but they never do. I don't think they've had any since the seventeenth century.

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2 years ago  ::  May 07, 2012 - 10:32PM #176
F1fan
Posts: 11,651

May 7, 2012 -- 4:53PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

In the most distilled sence, athiesm is a lack of belief in God(s). That takes in to account all possiblities, including newborns, or people who have lived in isolation or were otherwise never exposed to any ideas of God(s), theism.


However, that's a lack of belief stemming from a complete lack of knowledge. In case of most atheists one meets in society today -- including those here on these boards, atheism in an idea.



Only in the sense that it is an abstraction.  Most any word is an idea.  There is a definition to words that make them ideas, abstratctions.  This is how they mean something.  That the word atheism is an idea does not mean that it encompasses any belief to recognize or apply.


That being, the idea that no God(s) exists.



You cannot say this as if the context is limited to this.  Atheism is generally a response to thesim.  There is no non-belief, no atheism, without there being theists actively promoting their religion.  Atheism doesn't exist independently of theism.  Atheism is a reference specifically from a theistic position.  If there was no theism, there would be no atheists.


It's an idea stemming from knowlege. You have to know what something is, before you can reject it. 



And you have to demonstrate that what you claim is knowledge of an actual god, not your imagination.  We have no obligation to accept the many various claims of gods existing when we have better explanations for why humans believe in these irrational ideas.

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2 years ago  ::  May 08, 2012 - 10:09AM #177
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

May 7, 2012 -- 6:33PM, Ken wrote:


May 7, 2012 -- 6:30PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

But I wasn't talking in terms of tastes or opinions. I was talking in terms of ideas that might bolster atheism. I've not yet seen anything here particularly compelling in that regard. Just the same old stuff I've always seen.



But then you don't want to be an atheist.




"Want" has nothing to do with it. I was atheist at one point in my life.


I have to go with what I understand to be true and real. 

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2 years ago  ::  May 08, 2012 - 10:13AM #178
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

May 7, 2012 -- 6:46PM, steven_guy wrote:


May 7, 2012 -- 6:30PM, mytmouse57 wrote:


Of course it does. Your opinons in your posts reflect that regularly. Just as theism shapes my opinons.





Don't YOU tell ME what shapes MY opinions, buster! I know who and what I am. You know SFA about me and my life.




Ever consider switching to decaf?


And you know less about me and my life. So what?


Atheism will affect how one views the world and/or frame of reality -- just as theism will. Therefore, one's opinions also will inevitably be affected. 


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2 years ago  ::  May 08, 2012 - 10:16AM #179
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

May 7, 2012 -- 10:32PM, F1fan wrote:


May 7, 2012 -- 4:53PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

In the most distilled sence, athiesm is a lack of belief in God(s). That takes in to account all possiblities, including newborns, or people who have lived in isolation or were otherwise never exposed to any ideas of God(s), theism.


However, that's a lack of belief stemming from a complete lack of knowledge. In case of most atheists one meets in society today -- including those here on these boards, atheism in an idea.



Only in the sense that it is an abstraction.  Most any word is an idea.  There is a definition to words that make them ideas, abstratctions.  This is how they mean something.  That the word atheism is an idea does not mean that it encompasses any belief to recognize or apply.


That being, the idea that no God(s) exists.



You cannot say this as if the context is limited to this.  Atheism is generally a response to thesim.  There is no non-belief, no atheism, without there being theists actively promoting their religion.  Atheism doesn't exist independently of theism.  Atheism is a reference specifically from a theistic position.  If there was no theism, there would be no atheists.


It's an idea stemming from knowlege. You have to know what something is, before you can reject it. 



And you have to demonstrate that what you claim is knowledge of an actual god, not your imagination.  We have no obligation to accept the many various claims of gods existing when we have better explanations for why humans believe in these irrational ideas.




I don't fundamentally disagree with anything you've said here. Except I'm baffled about where the last part is coming from.


Regardless of whether you think God is pure imagination, a literal big angry man in the sky or something else, you have to have knowledge of a thing/concept/idea before you can have a response to it.


Which is, pretty much, what you just said. 

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2 years ago  ::  May 08, 2012 - 10:37AM #180
Fodaoson
Posts: 11,158

Atheism is more than an Idea or the lack of belief in a deity.   For an individual  it is “ without god”  but there are atheist associations , organization that promote atheism and atheist  support  services organizations.  Some have  been granted Tax exempt status by the IRS.   I have cited four sites below. There are many more on line:


www.atheistalliance.org/


www.americanhumanist.org/


www.humanism.org.uk/home


militaryatheists.org/

“I seldom make the mistake of arguing with people for whose opinions I have no respect.” Edward Gibbon
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