If you think that the gospels contain direct quotations from the historical Jesus, can you please make an evidence-based case as to why?

What texts are you citing?

What language are they in?

From what year?

How well does the Greek map on to terms used in Aramaic?¹

How many variations on the text have been noted, and are any of them substantive?²

If there are substantive differences, what established criteria do you cite in determining which version is the authentic version and which is the aberration?

Please add any additional information beyond these preliminary questions to establish the evidence that the words attributed to Jesus in the gospels are accurate quotations from the historical person during his life.

 
¹ e.g. In Aramaic, Mari was a respectful form of address, similar to Rabbi. In Greek this was at times translated as kyrios. While Mari expressed the relationship between Jesus and his disciples during his life, the Greek kyrios came to represent his lordship over the world. (Cullmann, 1959:202).

² John Mill - Novum Testamentum 'Mill spent thirty years on this tome, seeing it through to publication just two weeks before his death. Using the third edition (1550) of Stephanus’s Greek New Testament as his base text, he produced an apparatus that gave the readings of 100 Greek manuscripts as well as those of several church fathers and versions. This apparatus revealed 30,000 variants among the witnesses...)

What we have is second or third hand recollections plus more than a few false insertions.

Do you recall playing telegraph as a child - same thing.

Apr 27, 2012 -- 8:36AM, Kwinters wrote:

Apr 27, 2012 -- 8:20AM, Adelphe wrote:

Christians use an established canon.

We don't ask all of those questions re the established canon because all of that analysis has already been (and continues to be) done (which makes it...canon.)

And can you cite specifically who did this analysis?  When? And what the criteria was?

Because I don't think you will be able to produce any specific names, any specific dates, and any specific criteria.

Sure, apart from what you can find on wiki, for example, or a basic Google search, I will try to dig up a more technical article I've used in the past.

btw, I find it odd you think there aren't any specifics.  You won't find, for example, "The Gospel of the Hebrews" in the canon.  What, do you think that the "criterion" for excluding it was that Christians "just didn't like it"?

Apr 27, 2012 -- 8:46AM, Kwinters wrote:

Apr 27, 2012 -- 8:43AM, Adelphe wrote:

Apr 27, 2012 -- 8:36AM, Kwinters wrote:

Apr 27, 2012 -- 8:20AM, Adelphe wrote:

Christians use an established canon.

We don't ask all of those questions re the established canon because all of that analysis has already been (and continues to be) done (which makes it...canon.)

And can you cite specifically who did this analysis?  When? And what the criteria was?

Because I don't think you will be able to produce any specific names, any specific dates, and any specific criteria.

Sure, apart from what you can find on wiki, for example, or a basic Google search, I will try to dig up a more technical article I've used in the past.

I look forward to your sourced response.

(Will be after work so might take me a bit but) my pleasure.

For the record, here's what I am confident Jesus said ; believe in me, follow me, and the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

My criteria are gleanings from the Jesus seminar votes of authenticity.

We can't prove Jesus said too much. But I am sure though he said a lot more than was recorded in the Gospels.

Question: are the sayings of the resurrected Jesus authentic. What about Gnostic literiture, those are completely spiritually revealed. How can we know if they are authentic? Much of the Gospel of Philips are resurrection sayings and do you wonder about the Gosple of John's Jesus sayings? Could the I Am sayings be from the resurrected Jesus?  

How about the Book of Revelation, pretty scarry stuff, does that sound like Jesus? Which resurrected sayings do you believe in? The ones that continue teaching wisdom and knowledge or the ones that scare the hell out of you? The answer seems to be we believe in the resurrected sayings that scare the hell out of us.

I say believe what resonates as true for you.