Post Reply
Page 2 of 6  •  Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next
Switch to Forum Live View The rise of Atheism in the US
3 years ago  ::  Apr 14, 2012 - 11:34AM #11
IDBC
Posts: 4,556

 Howdy Costrel


Apr 14, 2012 -- 1:37AM, JCarlin wrote:

 I doubt atheists as such will become a political segment of the population.  It would be nice however, and I think it is coming rapidly, if an atheist would have the same rights as Mormons, Catholics, and UCC's to run for political office openly.  Not pushing those beliefs on others like the Mormons and Catholics, but able to run as an atheist not as a religious person. 



Apr 14, 2012 -- 10:04AM, costrel wrote:


 I agree that it would be nice if atheists could openly run for political office, even run for president. Yet I also think that atheists would do well to steer clear of American politics. American politics is corrupt, the gamboling fields of the rich and the arrogant and those with delusions of grandeur, and is little more than an offshoot of American Christianity. In other words, I think that atheists would do well to reject both politics and religion and be not only atheistical but also apolitical. During the last presidential election, I became interested in politics for the first time in my life. Now, four years later, I am concluding that I had made a mistake and that I should have remained apolitical and disinterested in politics and so-called political "solutions." 




I do agree with you that American politcs is "corrupt". However I think that the "corruption" is at least partly due to the efforts of Neo-Conservative Theorcrats to theocrize the U.S.  And that is one reason why I think Atheist should get more involved in politics.  


I do agree that there is a possiblity that Atheists may be "corrupted" by politics.  That is one thing that Atheists should NOT learn from Theists. 


Not particpating in politics is no more a solution then not voting.  If you do not vote or particpate in politics you can bet more than a dollar that theists especailly of the right-wing Christian will vote, and will elect politicans that want to establish or re-establish a Christian country guided by our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. 


When Obama mentioned "unbelievers" in his first inaugural speech, Atheists I know had an orgasm(metaphorically).  I still know Atheists who hope and believe that he is a Crypto-Atheists who is afraid to "come out of the closet" for fear of the backlash.  


I think there is even less evidence for this than there is for him being a Crypto-Muslim. 


There is a newly formed National Atheists Party:


www.usanap.org/


Wether it will be successful or not I do not know. 


What I do know is that if you do nothing you will get nothing.  


Another group of atheist activist that is getting into politics.  


www.enlightenthevote.com/


I certainly can understand the disappointment with Chocolate Jesus. 


However I would be even MORE disappointed had Lefty been elected. 


Life is full of disappointments.  I am still disappointed that I never got that pony for Christmas! 


So far as I am concerned when I get so "disappointed" that I stop voting the "bad guys" have won. 


When I stop voting I start shooting! 


 


 


 

HAVE A THINKING DAY MAY REASON GUIDE YOU
Quick Reply
Cancel
3 years ago  ::  Apr 14, 2012 - 11:40AM #12
JCarlin
Posts: 6,770

Apr 14, 2012 -- 10:04AM, costrel wrote:

  During the last presidential election, I became interested in politics for the first time in my life. Now, four years later, I am concluding that I had made a mistake and that I should have remained apolitical and disinterested in politics and so-called political "solutions." 


I made the same mistake.  Their incessant requests for $25 or whatever you can afford are sent back in their postage paid envelope with a marker scrawl "Fool me once, shame on you.  Fool me twice, shame on me."  Bowdlerized due to the fact that I learned it when I was 10.  Never forgot it. 

J'Carlin
If the shoe doesn't fit, don't cram your foot in it and complain.
Quick Reply
Cancel
3 years ago  ::  Apr 14, 2012 - 11:48AM #13
Ken
Posts: 33,859

Apr 14, 2012 -- 11:34AM, IDBC wrote:

What I do know is that if you do nothing you will get nothing.


I fully expect to get nothing. I am sick of hearing about the wonderful things that are going to happen thirty or forty years from now, when I'll be too old or too dead to benefit from them. If I can't have them now, to hell with them.

Quick Reply
Cancel
3 years ago  ::  Apr 14, 2012 - 12:13PM #14
JCarlin
Posts: 6,770

Apr 14, 2012 -- 10:04AM, costrel wrote:

Yet I also think that atheists would do well to steer clear of American politics. American politics is corrupt, the gamboling fields of the rich and the arrogant and those with delusions of grandeur, and is little more than an offshoot of American Christianity. In other words, I think that atheists would do well to reject both politics and religion and be not only atheistical but also apolitical.


I think this is actually the case at this point.  Politics is simply involved in the distribution of useless money, that is money which doesn't produce anything.  The producers of the world, the teachers, scientists, engineers and manufacturers, which according to my unscientific observations are largely atheistic and apolitical seem to be able to continue to find the working money to produce.  They are happy to recycle useless money into creative ads, but this is a minor part of the useless money equation.  


The "unfortunate" part of all of this is that the useless money that used to be recycled to the religious poor is now reserved for the religious rich.  But the religious poor may be figuring out that they are being abused by their religion's PACs and voting against religion if not God.    

J'Carlin
If the shoe doesn't fit, don't cram your foot in it and complain.
Quick Reply
Cancel
3 years ago  ::  Apr 14, 2012 - 9:34PM #15
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

Apr 13, 2012 -- 11:07PM, rangerken wrote:

Here is an article about he rise of Atheism in the United States. I thuink it is worth reading and discussing...so, here it is.

rise-atheism-america

Here is a key paragraph...

"If growth continues at the current rate, one in four Americans will profess no religious faith within 20 years. Silverman hopes that as nonbelief spreads, atheists can become a "legitimate political segment of the American population," afforded the same protections as religious groups and ethnic minorities. But he's not advocating a complete secular takeover of the U.S. — nor would he be likely to achieve one, given the abiding religious faith of most Americans. "We don't want the obliteration of religion; we don't want religion wiped off the face of the earth," Silverman said. "All we demand is equality."

Comments???

Rangerken



Not having a specific religious faith isn't always the same as being atheist. There are plenty of non-religious theists out there.

Quick Reply
Cancel
3 years ago  ::  Apr 14, 2012 - 9:36PM #16
mytmouse57
Posts: 9,782

Apr 13, 2012 -- 11:37PM, teilhard wrote:


I suspect that a fair percentage of Americans have ALWAYS been "Religious" mostly or even only in a Cultural Respect ... Such Folks now increasingly feel more free to say in public what they truly think and believe ...





I agree.

Quick Reply
Cancel
3 years ago  ::  Apr 14, 2012 - 10:44PM #17
mountain_man
Posts: 39,650

Apr 14, 2012 -- 9:34PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

Not having a specific religious faith isn't always the same as being atheist. There are plenty of non-religious theists out there.


A "non-religious theist" is an oxymoron. A religion is nothing more than a god belief. It need not be "organized," or written down, or believed by more than one  person. A theist is nothing more than a god believer. It doesn't matter which god or gods. So, if one is a theist they have a religion.


Of course believers love to play games using various definitions, even ones they make up themselves, but they always end up being based on equivocations. They use many different definitions at the same time.


Wikipedia: Religion is a collection of cultural systems, belief systems, and worldviews that establishes symbols that relate humanity to spirituality and, sometimes, to moral values.


Dictionary.com: a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies...


I can get more, and each entry has multiple definitions. The ones I chose support the definition I used; anyone believing in a god has a religion.

Dave - Just a Man in the Mountains.

I am a Humanist. I believe in a rational philosophy of life, informed by science, inspired by art, and motivated by a desire to do good for its own sake and not by an expectation of a reward or fear of punishment in an afterlife.
Quick Reply
Cancel
3 years ago  ::  Apr 14, 2012 - 11:40PM #18
teilhard
Posts: 51,355

A "non-Religious 'Theist'" COULD be, e.g., a "Deist" ... I don't know that a "Deist 'Theist'" would necessarily be a Practitioner of a "Religion," per se ...


Apr 14, 2012 -- 10:44PM, mountain_man wrote:


Apr 14, 2012 -- 9:34PM, mytmouse57 wrote:

Not having a specific religious faith isn't always the same as being atheist. There are plenty of non-religious theists out there.


A "non-religious theist" is an oxymoron. A religion is nothing more than a god belief. It need not be "organized," or written down, or believed by more than one  person. A theist is nothing more than a god believer. It doesn't matter which god or gods. So, if one is a theist they have a religion.


Of course believers love to play games using various definitions, even ones they make up themselves, but they always end up being based on equivocations. They use many different definitions at the same time.


Wikipedia: Religion is a collection of cultural systems, belief systems, and worldviews that establishes symbols that relate humanity to spirituality and, sometimes, to moral values.


Dictionary.com: a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies...


I can get more, and each entry has multiple definitions. The ones I chose support the definition I used; anyone believing in a god has a religion.





Quick Reply
Cancel
3 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 8:54PM #19
NATAS
Posts: 924

Howdy Ken


Apr 14, 2012 -- 11:34AM, IDBC wrote:

What I do know is that if you do nothing you will get nothing.



 


Apr 14, 2012 -- 11:48AM, Ken wrote:

 I fully expect to get nothing



An excellent way of thinking to avoid being disappointed. 


Apr 14, 2012 -- 11:48AM, Ken wrote:


 


. I am sick of hearing about the wonderful things that are going to happen thirty or forty years from now, when I'll be too old or too dead to benefit from them. If I can't have them now, to hell with them. 



Perfectly understandable.  I am not a prophet or a psychic.  Many of the "wonderful" things that were predicted thirty of forty years ago have not happened now.  There is no guarantee the the "wonderful"  rate of people not identifying with a religion will continue. I think it would be "wonderful" if it did, but only time will tell.  I am also at an age where I doubt that I will be alive in thrirty of forty years.  I don't have any children.


However I do have neices and nephews and I think it would be a "wonderful" thing if they did not have to live in a world of supersition.   A world or at country that is not dominated by right wing fundamentalist, wether Christian, Muslim or Jewish.  


Now it may well be that Apostles of Reason will not be successful in defeating the Apostles of Religious Superstitions.   It will be then up to my nieces and nephews to deal with the problem.


They could of course do nothing and avoid being disappointed. 


 




 





Quick Reply
Cancel
3 years ago  ::  Apr 15, 2012 - 10:03PM #20
JCarlin
Posts: 6,770

Apr 14, 2012 -- 11:34AM, IDBC wrote:

So far as I am concerned when I get so "disappointed" that I stop voting the "bad guys" have won. 


When I stop voting I start shooting!  


Unfortunately, that may be necessary.  The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.  Thos. Jefferson.  The USA seems to have approved assassination as a political tool, and the religious right has demonstrated agreement.  I don't think the tactic will be necessary. Police attacks on Occupy Groups, the wingnut war on women and defunding of Limbaugh and ALEC by social network action have me quite optimistic about the November election.  The lame duck won't fool me again. There should be a substantial majority to compel compliance.   I will vote for him but money and time will go to insure that my representatives are on my side.   


However, that said, atheists are heavily involved in the political process just not as atheists.  We pick candidates carefully, support them with money and activism, (occasionally being fooled once) and vote and get out the vote.  We work beside theists, pagans, and people with no apparant religious beliefs. 

J'Carlin
If the shoe doesn't fit, don't cram your foot in it and complain.
Quick Reply
Cancel
Page 2 of 6  •  Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next
 
    Viewing this thread :: 0 registered and 1 guest
    No registered users viewing
    Advertisement

    Beliefnet On Facebook