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Switch to Forum Live View Is the Book of Revelation just an old yarn?
3 years ago  ::  Jun 10, 2012 - 2:28PM #91
miknik5
Posts: 7,684

Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:54PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:34PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:16PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:02AM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 7:36AM, LittleLes wrote:


MikNik5 posted:


>>The book of Revelation is TRUTH...The book is for HIS BRIDE...to tell them what WILL happen...<<


RESPONSE:


The Book of Revelation is fiction much like Harry Potter novels  which some writers have noted.


But if you believe it is divinely inspired, it speaks volumes about your mindset.Wink



 


Men giving opinions?  I don't know who I should listen to...should I listen to men, or should I REMAIN IN WHO I BEGAN IN FROM THE BEGINNING?


I think I shall choose the latter and forget the former.




RESPONSE:


As the ancient Arab proverb teaches us:


He who knows not and knows not he knows not: he is a fool-shun him.
He who knows not and knows he knows not: he is simple-teach him.
He who knows and knows not he knows: he is asleep-wake him.
He who knows and knows he knows: he is wise-follow him.






And He who knows GOD, listens to GOD...and waits to hear HIS VOICE...that is a man of integrity...who is not double-minded...but stands firm and fast in the FAITH which HE began in...and remains IN HIM who is FAITHFUL AND TRUE.


For HE who REMAINS in what he began in from the beginning...has BOTH the FATHER and THE SON...and this is even our FAITH...and this is even what HE promised us...even eternal life.


And, eternal life is ONLY found in THE SON whom HE sent for the sins of the world.


I would rather have my hopes and my trust and my faith in HIM than in the sayings of fools.



 




RESPONSE:


Rev 22:7 "‘See, I am coming soon! "


Rev 22:12 "‘See, I am coming soon;


Did he???


So much for faith in the Book of Revelation.   Wink


What has changed, friend...2Peter 3...


He will come again...and ALL shall see HIS GLORY...even those who pierced HIM.


And yet, when HE comes...will HE find FAITH...for during the evils which will overflow in the last days, how could flesh be saved...but for the elect, HE will shorten the days.


Even so, come LORD JESUS...


And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that hears say, Come. And let him that is thirsty come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.And let the BRIDE say come..


 

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 10, 2012 - 6:30PM #92
LittleLes
Posts: 9,994

Merriam Webster of "soon" : without undue time lapse : before long


Hint: 2,000 years isn't "soon."


Rev 22:7 "‘See, I am coming soon! "


Rev 22:12 "‘See, I am coming soon;"



Did he???


1 Thes 4:1517
"For this we declare to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will by no means precede those who have died.


For the Lord himself, with a cry of command, with the archangel’s call and with the sound of God’s trumpet, will descend from heaven, and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up in the clouds together with them to meet the Lord in the air; and so we will be with the Lord for ever.


It just didn't happen.


And:


Rev 22
:"But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the polluted, the murderers, the fornicators, the sorcerers, the idolaters, and all liars, their place will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulphur, which is the second death."


So they get to die twice? Do you think John will be in this group for writing such a outrageous yarn?Wink

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 10, 2012 - 6:33PM #93
Buggsy
Posts: 4,731

Rev 22
"But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the polluted, the murderers, the fornicators, the sorcerers, the idolaters, and all liars, their place will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulphur, which is the second death."


hmmm  . . . I wonder what category politicians fall into

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 10, 2012 - 6:45PM #94
miknik5
Posts: 7,684

Jun 10, 2012 -- 6:30PM, LittleLes wrote:


Merriam Webster of "soon" : without undue time lapse : before long


Hint: 2,000 years isn't "soon."


Rev 22:7 "‘See, I am coming soon! "


Rev 22:12 "‘See, I am coming soon;"



Did he???


1 Thes 4:1517
"For this we declare to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will by no means precede those who have died.


For the Lord himself, with a cry of command, with the archangel’s call and with the sound of God’s trumpet, will descend from heaven, and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up in the clouds together with them to meet the Lord in the air; and so we will be with the Lord for ever.


It just didn't happen.


And:


Rev 22
:"But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the polluted, the murderers, the fornicators, the sorcerers, the idolaters, and all liars, their place will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulphur, which is the second death."


So they get to die twice? Do you think John will be in this group for writing such a outrageous yarn?Wink


Nope...all will die once...but not all shall die the second death.


And as for John, no...I think John is also included with the souls who cry out under the altar...how long Oh Sovereign Lord, until you avenge our deaths?

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 10, 2012 - 8:20PM #95
miknik5
Posts: 7,684

Jun 10, 2012 -- 2:28PM, miknik5 wrote:

Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:54PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:34PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:16PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:02AM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 7:36AM, LittleLes wrote:


MikNik5 posted:


>>The book of Revelation is TRUTH...The book is for HIS BRIDE...to tell them what WILL happen...<<


RESPONSE:


The Book of Revelation is fiction much like Harry Potter novels  which some writers have noted.


But if you believe it is divinely inspired, it speaks volumes about your mindset.Wink



 


Men giving opinions?  I don't know who I should listen to...should I listen to men, or should I REMAIN IN WHO I BEGAN IN FROM THE BEGINNING?


I think I shall choose the latter and forget the former.




RESPONSE:


As the ancient Arab proverb teaches us:


He who knows not and knows not he knows not: he is a fool-shun him.
He who knows not and knows he knows not: he is simple-teach him.
He who knows and knows not he knows: he is asleep-wake him.
He who knows and knows he knows: he is wise-follow him.






And He who knows GOD, listens to GOD...and waits to hear HIS VOICE...that is a man of integrity...who is not double-minded...but stands firm and fast in the FAITH which HE began in...and remains IN HIM who is FAITHFUL AND TRUE.


For HE who REMAINS in what he began in from the beginning...has BOTH the FATHER and THE SON...and this is even our FAITH...and this is even what HE promised us...even eternal life.


And, eternal life is ONLY found in THE SON whom HE sent for the sins of the world.


I would rather have my hopes and my trust and my faith in HIM than in the sayings of fools.



 




RESPONSE:


Rev 22:7 "‘See, I am coming soon! "


Rev 22:12 "‘See, I am coming soon;


Did he???


So much for faith in the Book of Revelation.   Wink


What has changed, friend...2Peter 3...


He will come again...and ALL shall see HIS GLORY...even those who pierced HIM.


And yet, when HE comes...will HE find FAITH...for during the evils which will overflow in the last days, how could flesh be saved...but for the elect, HE will shorten the days.


Even so, come LORD JESUS...


And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that hears say, Come. And let him that is thirsty come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.And let the BRIDE say come..


 


I don't know how to explain this to you so that you will understand that it is his long-suffering patience that we may repent and turn to HIM...for it is not HIS desire that any should perish but that all should come to the knowledge of HIS SON...


The fact that HE has not come yet...means that the numbers in CHRIST are not complete...yet.


GOD is calling whom HE is calling into the body of HIS SON...but it is only when the last of HIS ENEMIES are under HIM, that the GOSPEL will be opened to the Jews...and they also will come in.


But for now, the GOSPEL is being preached and who ever will come to HIM and drink...let him come to HIM and drink of the living water...which is that well-spring that draws us upward and unto the presence of GOD.

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 10, 2012 - 9:55PM #96
LittleLes
Posts: 9,994

Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:20PM, miknik5 wrote:

Jun 10, 2012 -- 2:28PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:54PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:34PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:16PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:02AM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 7:36AM, LittleLes wrote:


MikNik5 posted:


>>The book of Revelation is TRUTH...The book is for HIS BRIDE...to tell them what WILL happen...<<


RESPONSE:


The Book of Revelation is fiction much like Harry Potter novels  which some writers have noted.


But if you believe it is divinely inspired, it speaks volumes about your mindset.Wink



 


Men giving opinions?  I don't know who I should listen to...should I listen to men, or should I REMAIN IN WHO I BEGAN IN FROM THE BEGINNING?


I think I shall choose the latter and forget the former.




RESPONSE:


As the ancient Arab proverb teaches us:


He who knows not and knows not he knows not: he is a fool-shun him.
He who knows not and knows he knows not: he is simple-teach him.
He who knows and knows not he knows: he is asleep-wake him.
He who knows and knows he knows: he is wise-follow him.






And He who knows GOD, listens to GOD...and waits to hear HIS VOICE...that is a man of integrity...who is not double-minded...but stands firm and fast in the FAITH which HE began in...and remains IN HIM who is FAITHFUL AND TRUE.


For HE who REMAINS in what he began in from the beginning...has BOTH the FATHER and THE SON...and this is even our FAITH...and this is even what HE promised us...even eternal life.


And, eternal life is ONLY found in THE SON whom HE sent for the sins of the world.


I would rather have my hopes and my trust and my faith in HIM than in the sayings of fools.



 




RESPONSE:


Rev 22:7 "‘See, I am coming soon! "


Rev 22:12 "‘See, I am coming soon;


Did he???


So much for faith in the Book of Revelation.   Wink


What has changed, friend...2Peter 3...


He will come again...and ALL shall see HIS GLORY...even those who pierced HIM.


And yet, when HE comes...will HE find FAITH...for during the evils which will overflow in the last days, how could flesh be saved...but for the elect, HE will shorten the days.


Even so, come LORD JESUS...


And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that hears say, Come. And let him that is thirsty come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.And let the BRIDE say come..


 




I don't know how to explain this to you so that you will understand that it is his long-suffering patience that we may repent and turn to HIM...for it is not HIS desire that any should perish but that all should come to the knowledge of HIS SON...


The fact that HE has not come yet...means that the numbers in CHRIST are not complete...yet.


GOD is calling whom HE is calling into the body of HIS SON...but it is only when the last of HIS ENEMIES are under HIM, that the GOSPEL will be opened to the Jews...and they also will come in.


But for now, the GOSPEL is being preached and who ever will come to HIM and drink...let him come to HIM and drink of the living water...which is that well-spring that draws us upward and unto the presence of GOD.





RESPONSE:


Yes indeed. The Book of Revelation is being read the same as is Harry Potter. Both are non-historical. Some of us don't build  our belief system on fiction.


But some do. It's up to the individual to decide. Wink

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 12:00AM #97
miknik5
Posts: 7,684

Jun 10, 2012 -- 9:55PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:20PM, miknik5 wrote:

Jun 10, 2012 -- 2:28PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:54PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:34PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:16PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:02AM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 7:36AM, LittleLes wrote:


MikNik5 posted:


>>The book of Revelation is TRUTH...The book is for HIS BRIDE...to tell them what WILL happen...<<


RESPONSE:


The Book of Revelation is fiction much like Harry Potter novels  which some writers have noted.


But if you believe it is divinely inspired, it speaks volumes about your mindset.Wink



 


Men giving opinions?  I don't know who I should listen to...should I listen to men, or should I REMAIN IN WHO I BEGAN IN FROM THE BEGINNING?


I think I shall choose the latter and forget the former.




RESPONSE:


As the ancient Arab proverb teaches us:


He who knows not and knows not he knows not: he is a fool-shun him.
He who knows not and knows he knows not: he is simple-teach him.
He who knows and knows not he knows: he is asleep-wake him.
He who knows and knows he knows: he is wise-follow him.






And He who knows GOD, listens to GOD...and waits to hear HIS VOICE...that is a man of integrity...who is not double-minded...but stands firm and fast in the FAITH which HE began in...and remains IN HIM who is FAITHFUL AND TRUE.


For HE who REMAINS in what he began in from the beginning...has BOTH the FATHER and THE SON...and this is even our FAITH...and this is even what HE promised us...even eternal life.


And, eternal life is ONLY found in THE SON whom HE sent for the sins of the world.


I would rather have my hopes and my trust and my faith in HIM than in the sayings of fools.



 




RESPONSE:


Rev 22:7 "‘See, I am coming soon! "


Rev 22:12 "‘See, I am coming soon;


Did he???


So much for faith in the Book of Revelation.   Wink


What has changed, friend...2Peter 3...


He will come again...and ALL shall see HIS GLORY...even those who pierced HIM.


And yet, when HE comes...will HE find FAITH...for during the evils which will overflow in the last days, how could flesh be saved...but for the elect, HE will shorten the days.


Even so, come LORD JESUS...


And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that hears say, Come. And let him that is thirsty come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.And let the BRIDE say come..


 




I don't know how to explain this to you so that you will understand that it is his long-suffering patience that we may repent and turn to HIM...for it is not HIS desire that any should perish but that all should come to the knowledge of HIS SON...


The fact that HE has not come yet...means that the numbers in CHRIST are not complete...yet.


GOD is calling whom HE is calling into the body of HIS SON...but it is only when the last of HIS ENEMIES are under HIM, that the GOSPEL will be opened to the Jews...and they also will come in.


But for now, the GOSPEL is being preached and who ever will come to HIM and drink...let him come to HIM and drink of the living water...which is that well-spring that draws us upward and unto the presence of GOD.





RESPONSE:


Yes indeed. The Book of Revelation is being read the same as is Harry Potter. Both are non-historical. Some of us don't build  our belief system on fiction.


But some do. It's up to the individual to decide. Wink




 


How can I respond to this? 


I guess you have your opinions.  And with that, your opinions of others...


 I will leave you with your opinions then.

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 8:24AM #98
LittleLes
Posts: 9,994

Jun 11, 2012 -- 12:00AM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 9:55PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:20PM, miknik5 wrote:

Jun 10, 2012 -- 2:28PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:54PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:34PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:16PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:02AM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 7:36AM, LittleLes wrote:


MikNik5 posted:


>>The book of Revelation is TRUTH...The book is for HIS BRIDE...to tell them what WILL happen...<<


RESPONSE:


The Book of Revelation is fiction much like Harry Potter novels  which some writers have noted.


But if you believe it is divinely inspired, it speaks volumes about your mindset.Wink



 


Men giving opinions?  I don't know who I should listen to...should I listen to men, or should I REMAIN IN WHO I BEGAN IN FROM THE BEGINNING?


I think I shall choose the latter and forget the former.




RESPONSE:


As the ancient Arab proverb teaches us:


He who knows not and knows not he knows not: he is a fool-shun him.
He who knows not and knows he knows not: he is simple-teach him.
He who knows and knows not he knows: he is asleep-wake him.
He who knows and knows he knows: he is wise-follow him.






And He who knows GOD, listens to GOD...and waits to hear HIS VOICE...that is a man of integrity...who is not double-minded...but stands firm and fast in the FAITH which HE began in...and remains IN HIM who is FAITHFUL AND TRUE.


For HE who REMAINS in what he began in from the beginning...has BOTH the FATHER and THE SON...and this is even our FAITH...and this is even what HE promised us...even eternal life.


And, eternal life is ONLY found in THE SON whom HE sent for the sins of the world.


I would rather have my hopes and my trust and my faith in HIM than in the sayings of fools.



 




RESPONSE:


Rev 22:7 "‘See, I am coming soon! "


Rev 22:12 "‘See, I am coming soon;


Did he???


So much for faith in the Book of Revelation.   Wink


What has changed, friend...2Peter 3...


He will come again...and ALL shall see HIS GLORY...even those who pierced HIM.


And yet, when HE comes...will HE find FAITH...for during the evils which will overflow in the last days, how could flesh be saved...but for the elect, HE will shorten the days.


Even so, come LORD JESUS...


And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that hears say, Come. And let him that is thirsty come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.And let the BRIDE say come..


 




I don't know how to explain this to you so that you will understand that it is his long-suffering patience that we may repent and turn to HIM...for it is not HIS desire that any should perish but that all should come to the knowledge of HIS SON...


The fact that HE has not come yet...means that the numbers in CHRIST are not complete...yet.


GOD is calling whom HE is calling into the body of HIS SON...but it is only when the last of HIS ENEMIES are under HIM, that the GOSPEL will be opened to the Jews...and they also will come in.


But for now, the GOSPEL is being preached and who ever will come to HIM and drink...let him come to HIM and drink of the living water...which is that well-spring that draws us upward and unto the presence of GOD.





RESPONSE:


Yes indeed. The Book of Revelation is being read the same as is Harry Potter. Both are non-historical. Some of us don't build  our belief system on fiction.


But some do. It's up to the individual to decide. Wink




 


How can I respond to this? 


I guess you have your opinions.  And with that, your opinions of others...


 I will leave you with your opinions then.





RESPONSE:


Broadly speaking, there are two categories of views regarding the relationship between faith and rationality:


Rationalism holds that truth should be determined by reason and factual analysis, rather than faith, dogma, tradition or religious teaching.


Fideism holds that faith is necessary, and that beliefs may be held without evidence or reason, or even in conflict with evidence and reason.


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faith_and_rational...


Yes, indeed. Some of us prefer to remain rational.

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 8:55AM #99
miknik5
Posts: 7,684

Jun 11, 2012 -- 8:24AM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 11, 2012 -- 12:00AM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 9:55PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:20PM, miknik5 wrote:

Jun 10, 2012 -- 2:28PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:54PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:34PM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 12:16PM, LittleLes wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 8:02AM, miknik5 wrote:


Jun 10, 2012 -- 7:36AM, LittleLes wrote:


MikNik5 posted:


>>The book of Revelation is TRUTH...The book is for HIS BRIDE...to tell them what WILL happen...<<


RESPONSE:


The Book of Revelation is fiction much like Harry Potter novels  which some writers have noted.


But if you believe it is divinely inspired, it speaks volumes about your mindset.Wink



 


Men giving opinions?  I don't know who I should listen to...should I listen to men, or should I REMAIN IN WHO I BEGAN IN FROM THE BEGINNING?


I think I shall choose the latter and forget the former.




RESPONSE:


As the ancient Arab proverb teaches us:


He who knows not and knows not he knows not: he is a fool-shun him.
He who knows not and knows he knows not: he is simple-teach him.
He who knows and knows not he knows: he is asleep-wake him.
He who knows and knows he knows: he is wise-follow him.






And He who knows GOD, listens to GOD...and waits to hear HIS VOICE...that is a man of integrity...who is not double-minded...but stands firm and fast in the FAITH which HE began in...and remains IN HIM who is FAITHFUL AND TRUE.


For HE who REMAINS in what he began in from the beginning...has BOTH the FATHER and THE SON...and this is even our FAITH...and this is even what HE promised us...even eternal life.


And, eternal life is ONLY found in THE SON whom HE sent for the sins of the world.


I would rather have my hopes and my trust and my faith in HIM than in the sayings of fools.



 




RESPONSE:


Rev 22:7 "‘See, I am coming soon! "


Rev 22:12 "‘See, I am coming soon;


Did he???


So much for faith in the Book of Revelation.   Wink


What has changed, friend...2Peter 3...


He will come again...and ALL shall see HIS GLORY...even those who pierced HIM.


And yet, when HE comes...will HE find FAITH...for during the evils which will overflow in the last days, how could flesh be saved...but for the elect, HE will shorten the days.


Even so, come LORD JESUS...


And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that hears say, Come. And let him that is thirsty come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.And let the BRIDE say come..


 




I don't know how to explain this to you so that you will understand that it is his long-suffering patience that we may repent and turn to HIM...for it is not HIS desire that any should perish but that all should come to the knowledge of HIS SON...


The fact that HE has not come yet...means that the numbers in CHRIST are not complete...yet.


GOD is calling whom HE is calling into the body of HIS SON...but it is only when the last of HIS ENEMIES are under HIM, that the GOSPEL will be opened to the Jews...and they also will come in.


But for now, the GOSPEL is being preached and who ever will come to HIM and drink...let him come to HIM and drink of the living water...which is that well-spring that draws us upward and unto the presence of GOD.





RESPONSE:


Yes indeed. The Book of Revelation is being read the same as is Harry Potter. Both are non-historical. Some of us don't build  our belief system on fiction.


But some do. It's up to the individual to decide. Wink




 


How can I respond to this? 


I guess you have your opinions.  And with that, your opinions of others...


 I will leave you with your opinions then.





RESPONSE:


Broadly speaking, there are two categories of views regarding the relationship between faith and rationality:


Rationalism holds that truth should be determined by reason and factual analysis, rather than faith, dogma, tradition or religious teaching.


Fideism holds that faith is necessary, and that beliefs may be held without evidence or reason, or even in conflict with evidence and reason.


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faith_and_rational...


Yes, indeed. Some of us prefer to remain rational.




I'm sorry...but it is GOD who opens the eyes of FAITH through HIS GRACE...so both are a gift from GOD and can not be received with the earthly eyes and ears...but only upon the inward flesh of the heart...


I know that I have already said this...but you can not understand spiritual things with earthly eyes and ears.



The prophecy of Isaiah remains...in seeing, they shall not see in hearing they shall not hear...lest they should understand (with the eyes and ears) with the hear and I should heal them...



This is why CHRIST said to Nicodemus if I speak to you in earthly terms and you can not understand, how will you understand when I speak of heavenly things...and this is why John said...a man can only receive what is given him from heaven...I told you I am not the CHRIST but am sent ahead of the bridegroom....the bride belongs to the bridegroom and the one who waits for him waits to hear his voice...my joy is fulfilled...he must increase I must decrease...the one who speaks of heaven speaks of what he has seen and heard but no one believes his testimony...the man who does...sets to the seal GOD is TRUE...for the ONE whom the FATHER sent speaks the words of GOD.



How can one be spiritual if one is not in relationship with the ONE AND ONLY LIVING GOD?


Yes,, there are many spirits...but if it is NOT GOD...than it is false and lying and deceiving spirits...and any spirit who denies that CHRIST has come in the flesh is not of GOD.



I am sorry...you need to be born again...and no man can do that work but GOD

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3 years ago  ::  Jun 12, 2012 - 7:04AM #100
LittleLes
Posts: 9,994

Please stop posting excessively long posts. Please stick to the facts and stop sermonizing.

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