Important Announcement

See here for an important message regarding the community which has become a read-only site as of October 31.

 
Post Reply
Page 1 of 24  •  1 2 3 4 5 6 ... 24 Next
Switch to Forum Live View Qur'an says Allah gave Israel to the Jews
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 11:59AM #1
NahumS
Posts: 1,868
I am hardly an Islamic scholar - but Sheikh Abdul Hadi Palazzi is certainly one.
Please visit this site and read his remarks.
 
www.templemount.org/quranland.html

Share your thoughts, please.
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 1:27PM #2
KindredSai
Posts: 7,425

Dec 27, 2011 -- 11:59AM, NahumS wrote:

I am hardly an Islamic scholar - but Sheikh Abdul Hadi Palazzi is certainly one.
Please visit this site and read his remarks.
 
www.templemount.org/quranland.html

Share your thoughts, please.



Although this is a religious thread more appropiate for a religious discussion, I'll give my thought in a political and religious context.


Sheikh Palazzi is not alone with his thoughts and his beliefs. Now and again we have Pro-Israelis and Zionists finding scholars be it mullahs, alims, or sheikhs who maintain a minority disposition: Allah promised the land to Jews.


In fact if we interprete the verse in mainstream Muslim belief, the children of Israel were Muslim in Islamic belief. This is the belief of most if not all mainstream Muslim scholars.


Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 2:05PM #3
Miraj
Posts: 5,021

According to the Quran, the Prophets among the ancient Hebrews, Moses, Abraham, David, etc., were Muslims, submitters to the will of God.  In concurrance, the promise of Israel was given to Muslims.  Those who violated His will are condemned in the Quran.  Palazzi admits that the Quran says nothing about today's Israel.  Following the prescription in the Quran, when today's Zionists become Muslims, then they will have earned the promise of a homeland.

Disclaimer: The opinions of this member are not primarily informed by western ethnocentric paradigms, stereotypes rooted in anti-Muslim/Islam hysteria, "Israel can do no wrong" intransigence, or the perceived need to protect the Judeo-Christian world from invading foreign religions and legal concepts.  By expressing such views, no inherent attempt is being made to derail or hijack threads, but that may be the result.  The result is not the responsibility of this member.


PhotobucketPhotobucket
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 2:08PM #4
Miraj
Posts: 5,021

I'll probably move this to DI. For now, I'll keep an eye on it and give it a chance to become more politically oriented.

Disclaimer: The opinions of this member are not primarily informed by western ethnocentric paradigms, stereotypes rooted in anti-Muslim/Islam hysteria, "Israel can do no wrong" intransigence, or the perceived need to protect the Judeo-Christian world from invading foreign religions and legal concepts.  By expressing such views, no inherent attempt is being made to derail or hijack threads, but that may be the result.  The result is not the responsibility of this member.


PhotobucketPhotobucket
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 2:15PM #5
rangerken
Posts: 16,967

None of this matters. It is totally beside the point. Worse, it continues a whole lot of follishness. The plain fact is, has been, and will be that the reason, and only reason that Israel belongs to Israelis (call them Jews if you wish though not all Israelis are Jews) is because, and only because, the Israelis are willing and able to defend the land they call their own...period! It's the same reason that Istanbul is no longer Constantinople, and what used to be East Prussia is part of Poland, and what was part of Mexico is Arizona, and what was once New France is Canada, and what was part of the Soviet Union is Ukraine, and so on and so forth and ever it has been and will continue to be!


What some holy book says means NOTHING if the ability and willingness to take whatever wichever so called holy book says and force it to be a fact on the ground does not exist.


Ken


PS. In case anyone wonders if I'm saying that might makes right...OF COURSE I AM...DUH!


______________________________________________________________________________


As my co-host, Miraj wrote, this thread probably should go to Discuss Islam, or maybe even Discuss Judaism unless it turns into something more of a political natue re: the Middle East.


Rangerken

Libertarian, Conservative, Life member of the NRA and VFW
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 2:25PM #6
Miraj
Posts: 5,021

I can't argue with that.  Another plain fact is, demographics inside of Israel, along with the deception of its leadership will lead to a single-state solution that will represent a true democracy, not one cobbled together on the justification that the supremacy of Jews is condoned by God.


Dec 27, 2011 -- 2:15PM, rangerken wrote:


None of this matters. It is totally beside the point. Worse, it continues a whole lot of follishness. The plain fact is, has been, and will be that the reason, and only reason that Israel belongs to Israelis (call them Jews if you wish though not all Israelis are Jews) is because, and only because, the Israelis are willing and able to defend the land they call their own...period! It's the same reason that Istanbul is no longer Constantinople, and what used to be East Prussia is part of Poland, and what was part of Mexico is Arizona, and what was once New France is Canada, and what was part of the Soviet Union is Ukraine, and so on and so forth and ever it has been and will continue to be!


What some holy book says means NOTHING if the ability and willingness to take whatever wichever so called holy book says and force it to be a fact on the ground does not exist.


Ken


PS. In case anyone wonders if I'm saying that might makes right...OF COURSE I AM...DUH!


______________________________________________________________________________


As my co-host, Miraj wrote, this thread probably should go to Discuss Islam, or maybe even Discuss Judaism unless it turns into something more of a political natue re: the Middle East.


Rangerken





Disclaimer: The opinions of this member are not primarily informed by western ethnocentric paradigms, stereotypes rooted in anti-Muslim/Islam hysteria, "Israel can do no wrong" intransigence, or the perceived need to protect the Judeo-Christian world from invading foreign religions and legal concepts.  By expressing such views, no inherent attempt is being made to derail or hijack threads, but that may be the result.  The result is not the responsibility of this member.


PhotobucketPhotobucket
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 2:32PM #7
rangerken
Posts: 16,967

Miraj, you wrote... "I can't argue with that.  Another plain fact is, demographics inside of Israel, along with the deception of its leadership will lead to a single-state solution that will represent a true democracy, not one cobbled together on the justification that the supremacy of Jews is condoned by God."...


I tend to agree. What we porobably don't agree about is what kind of state it will be. I think it will be 'Israel', a secular, modern state, and not one controlled by the Palesinians who will, I hope and think, end up with their own state.The supremacy of any religion needs to go away in terms of political power...and that damn well includes Islam as well as Judaism. Now Judaism does just fine in a secular society. The question is whether or not islam can do the same. So far, it doesn't seem to be able to do that.


Some recent reports of extreme Jewish Orthodox idiocy are 'interesting'...perhaps these fools and the Islamist fanatics deserve each other. Neither set of extremists have any business running a country.


Ken

Libertarian, Conservative, Life member of the NRA and VFW
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 2:44PM #8
Miraj
Posts: 5,021

Considering how much rancor the world has suffered re Judaism, it's hard to say that Judaism does just fine in secular societies and Islam does not.  Most Muslims live in secular/mixed societies.  Christianity and Judaism, however, now that's been a demonstrably volatile mix from ancient times into the 20th century.  In fact, Muslims have been drawn into conflicts between those two groups more often than the opposite.


PS - I have a meeting to attend and will be away for a while.  Not wanting to return to a slew of criticism that I'm blaming Jews for their being presecuted throughout history, let me be clear, I'm not.  


Later!


Dec 27, 2011 -- 2:32PM, rangerken wrote:


Miraj, you wrote... "I can't argue with that.  Another plain fact is, demographics inside of Israel, along with the deception of its leadership will lead to a single-state solution that will represent a true democracy, not one cobbled together on the justification that the supremacy of Jews is condoned by God."...


I tend to agree. What we porobably don't agree about is what kind of state it will be. I think it will be 'Israel', a secular, modern state, and not one controlled by the Palesinians who will, I hope and think, end up with their own state.The supremacy of any religion needs to go away in terms of political power...and that damn well includes Islam as well as Judaism. Now Judaism does just fine in a secular society. The question is whether or not islam can do the same. So far, it doesn't seem to be able to do that.


Some recent reports of extreme Jewish Orthodox idiocy are 'interesting'...perhaps these fools and the Islamist fanatics deserve each other. Neither set of extremists have any business running a country.


Ken





Moderated by rangerken on Dec 27, 2011 - 06:00PM
Disclaimer: The opinions of this member are not primarily informed by western ethnocentric paradigms, stereotypes rooted in anti-Muslim/Islam hysteria, "Israel can do no wrong" intransigence, or the perceived need to protect the Judeo-Christian world from invading foreign religions and legal concepts.  By expressing such views, no inherent attempt is being made to derail or hijack threads, but that may be the result.  The result is not the responsibility of this member.


PhotobucketPhotobucket
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 4:05PM #9
Ibn
Posts: 6,037

 


Miraj, you wrote... "I can't argue with that.  Another plain fact is, demographics inside of Israel, along with the deception of its leadership will lead to a single-state solution that will represent a true democracy, not one cobbled together on the justification that the supremacy of Jews is condoned by God."...


Dec 27, 2011 -- 2:32PM, rangerken wrote:

I tend to agree. What we porobably don't agree about is what kind of state it will be. I think it will be 'Israel', a secular, modern state, and not one controlled by the Palesinians who will, I hope and think, end up with their own state.



The only way there can be one State in which both the Palestinians and those who went there from other countries thinking that they will have their own land based on their religion, is if the State (the Land) is not identified with any religion. Otherwise, pretending it to be a secular State is deceiving the whole world.


Dec 27, 2011 -- 2:32PM, rangerken wrote:

The supremacy of any religion needs to go away in terms of political power...and that damn well includes Islam as well as Judaism.


After the USA helping to create a State because of Judaism? They did not keep religion and the State apart then, did they?What had happened to the Constitution in this matter?


Dec 27, 2011 -- 2:32PM, rangerken wrote:

Now Judaism does just fine in a secular society. The question is whether or not islam can do the same. So far, it doesn't seem to be able to do that.


Judaism does fine in a secular society? If that is the case then why have judaism at all? I am sure all will just do fine without Judaism in a secular society.


Dec 27, 2011 -- 2:32PM, rangerken wrote:

Some recent reports of extreme Jewish Orthodox idiocy are 'interesting'...perhaps these fools and the Islamist fanatics deserve each other. Neither set of extremists have any business running a country.


Ken



That's why they should all be together in the land call Israel.

Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
(Winston Churchill)
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Dec 27, 2011 - 6:44PM #10
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 19,045

I started a thread months ago on this topic. In it I detailed each sura which refered to Israel and showed that 1. the author(s) of the Koran knew full well that Muslims are not Jews and that Islam did not supplant Judaism and the Jewish people's claim on the land of Israel, and 2. that G-d granted the entire land of Israel including its capital city Jerusalem to the Jewish people. Not a single person commented on that thread. Would you like to hazard a guess as to why that was? 


Quick Reply
Cancel
Page 1 of 24  •  1 2 3 4 5 6 ... 24 Next
 
    Viewing this thread :: 0 registered and 1 guest
    No registered users viewing
    Advertisement

    Beliefnet On Facebook