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Switch to Forum Live View Opposing Political Islam
3 years ago  ::  Sep 18, 2011 - 3:45PM #111
BDboy
Posts: 5,818

Sep 17, 2011 -- 2:51PM, IDBC wrote:


 


Sep 11, 2011 -- 3:53PM, Lilwabbit wrote:


But there is no doubt that all the four Sunni schools of Islamic jurisprudence accept these penalties as "Islamic". (Most Muslim-majority states do not enforce them though.) 



Sep 11, 2011 -- 9:18PM, Miraj wrote:


The reason why they are not enforced is because fiqh laws are not divine and many are considered to be optional and/or situational.  The practice of the Prophet (pbuh) was to avoid hudud punishments and grant mercy.  


Ironically, one of the most controversial of these, stoning, is not from Islam at all.  It's from the Talmud.  Allah directed Muhammad to seek out the learned who had received the Book before, and, in so doing, stoning is one of the practices derived from his consultation with Jewish elders.  The Quran prescribes flogging for adulterers and forbids them to marry virgins.  It's hard to marry if you're dead.  


To the credit of the early scholars in developing fiqh, they make it clear that their determinations were made to fit the circumstances of the venue it applied to, and were not meant for all places and all times; that none of their determinatons was infallible; that if you disagreed that a ruling had a proper foundation in Sharia, you shouldn't follow it.  Even the concept of Sharia varies from madhad to madhab.  Trends within madhahib also play a role in the application of law, just as it does in secular law.


There is also a lot of pick and choose in applying fatawa, especially between what is allowed for men and what is allowed for women.  Prohibitions and requirements for women are sourced primarily in jurispridence, as are exceptions for men.  There is no central authority for Islam, although it is often portrayed that way.  There is actually little legislated in the Quran.  Most of the directives come from fiqh interpretations.




Ironically stoning is not practiced in Israel and hasn't been practiced by Jews for at least two weeks! 


And where is stoning still practiced? 


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoning


There is also no central authority in Christianity even thouigh it is more often portrayed that way by Muslims. 


 However if there was a central authority in Islam then perhaps they could make a ruling or reach a consensus forbidding stoning. 


 


 




 


>>>>>>>>. Ask Rumsfeld and he can give you details about how "Christians" torture or kill ( In many case innocent) people.


If you are trying to show any "Moral upperhand" over Muslims, it does not exist. Generally speaking Muslims need more mture institutions to ensure people have their day in court and have a chance to defend themselves. However stoning is very very rare among Muslims. I have NOT seen one in my life.


 




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3 years ago  ::  Oct 08, 2011 - 5:54AM #112
river8101
Posts: 5,561

Stoning is not practiced by Jews.  Period.  A couple thousand years ago in the Jewish bible there are incidents that it was practiced, but since there is no proof in either the Jewish, Christian or Muslim scripture that most any of their scriptures were actually true, and since I'd like to know where Jews practiced stoning 2 weeks ago (a lie about Jews per usual by Muslims) please forward the proof of such a stupid remark that wasn't in some Muslim newspaper.


Hello Arjun!   I agree with you, as usual.  My son and his wife and kids recently returned from a vacation in India.  I have the many photos on Facebook.  They're great!  I couldn't go, but maybe next time.  Meantime I kept their dog.  PS  It wasn't black!!!!  not that, that would have made any difference at all.  We're a doggie family.  LOL!


You really should come over to Facebook.  It's really interesting and fun!

“Faith is deciding to allow yourself to believe something your intellect would otherwise cause you to reject.”
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3 years ago  ::  Oct 08, 2011 - 6:43AM #113
BDboy
Posts: 5,818

Oct 8, 2011 -- 5:54AM, river8101 wrote:


Stoning is not practiced by Jews.  Period.  A couple thousand years ago in the Jewish bible there are incidents that it was practiced, but since there is no proof in either the Jewish, Christian or Muslim scripture that most any of their scriptures were actually true, and since I'd like to know where Jews practiced stoning 2 weeks ago (a lie about Jews per usual by Muslims) please forward the proof of such a stupid remark that wasn't in some Muslim newspaper.


Hello Arjun!   I agree with you, as usual.  My son and his wife and kids recently returned from a vacation in India.  I have the many photos on Facebook.  They're great!  I couldn't go, but maybe next time.  Meantime I kept their dog.  PS  It wasn't black!!!!  not that, that would have made any difference at all.  We're a doggie family.  LOL!


You really should come over to Facebook.  It's really interesting and fun!




 


>>>>>>>> Please help me understand what you are saying here.


If Jews stone someone or not that is there business and you should ask them about it. Same goes for OT (AKA Jewish Bible!) laws. Well it is there.


If you read anything that "Troubles" you, you should ask the writer or challenge that newspaper about it.


I can discuss recent contribution of "Some" Jews in human rights violations but that would be off topic. Maybe you can "Store" some of the rage and direct it where it should be.


Your "Generalization" about lies and Muslims are less than civilized and untrue for a faith community that is 1.7 BILLION strong!!


You are always welcome to ask questions but need to be more specific about it. Otherwise it looks and feels like rant. I don't think that is necessary here.


Shalom!

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2 years ago  ::  Sep 15, 2012 - 6:55AM #114
hajar1
Posts: 12

Miraj, your son is 13 already?  Wow, masha'Allah.Surprised

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