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Switch to Forum Live View The Law of Attraction vs. Prayer
6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 8:07AM #11
newsjunkie
Posts: 5,750

Jul 6, 2011 -- 12:28AM, johnacancienne wrote:


Jul 5, 2011 -- 11:30PM, davelaw40 wrote:


if you are going to sell the craft to nominal christians-it has to have a christian makeover





Well it turned off a lot of Pagans just because of it.... Maybe it wasn't Fundi enough, but it sure as hell ain't white magic (black magic, or any other color inbetween).


Can we at least agree it's a load of crap?




It's a total load of crap.

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6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 9:33AM #12
davelaw40
Posts: 19,669

Catholic mysticism, all you need is the name of Jesus and a clear conscience

Non Quis, Sed Quid
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 11:35AM #13
johnacancienne
Posts: 7,314

Jul 6, 2011 -- 9:33AM, davelaw40 wrote:


Catholic mysticism, all you need is the name of Jesus and a clear conscience





How about the Wizard of Oz? I might as well see just how far over the edge you've fallen.


People who take a look at movies and try to deduce some sort of religious theme out of them are pretty well over the top anyway. Stuff like that is for entertainment only (although I fail to see how one is entertained by horror and gore) and rarely if ever reflects the true nature of a religion. You must have missed that in Sunday School, Dave, and grew up thinking that's just "One More Way" to be seduced by the devil. If that is true, then you're in the wrong line of work. You'd fit in better as the prosecution, rather than the defense.

It isn't about waiting for the storms to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain.
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 11:53AM #14
davelaw40
Posts: 19,669

Jul 6, 2011 -- 11:35AM, johnacancienne wrote:


 


How about the Wizard of Oz? I might as well see just how far over the edge you've fallen.


 





Movies? I am discussing the books-The Secret was a book, right?  The HP series has classical pagan overtones, "Christian" themes, and Campbellian quests (typical Brit synchreticism)


 


Wizard sends mixed messages: you have good and bad witches-but the prevailing message is- pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.


 


I concede the Christianized version of the Law of Attraction isn't true craft- but like the name it and claim prosperity gospel types-it turns a (IMO THE) Diety into a mechanism-a mere force of nature to be manipulated-a genie in bottle

Non Quis, Sed Quid
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 11:56AM #15
johnacancienne
Posts: 7,314

Jul 6, 2011 -- 11:53AM, davelaw40 wrote:


Jul 6, 2011 -- 11:35AM, johnacancienne wrote:


 


How about the Wizard of Oz? I might as well see just how far over the edge you've fallen.


 





Movies? I am discussing the books-The Secret was a book, right?  The HP series has classical pagan overtones, "Christian" themes, and Campbellian quests (typical Brit synchreticism)


 


Wizard sends mixed messages: you have good and bad witches-but the prevailing message is- pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.


 


I concede the Christianized version of the Law of Attraction isn't true craft- but like the name it and claim prosperity gospel types-it turns a (IMO THE) Diety into a mechanism-a mere force of nature to be manipulated-a genie in bottle





You brought up Harry Potter, Dave. Not me. If you were speaking of the books Harry Potter, I never read them. My daughter did in High School, and loved the characters in each one. I don't know if the Exorsist ever was a book. I was going into anything, really that has some sort of religious undercurrent to it....


Right now.... Man, I'm lost. I don't know where you're trying to steer the conversation.


 

It isn't about waiting for the storms to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain.
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 11:58AM #16
davelaw40
Posts: 19,669

Jul 6, 2011 -- 11:35AM, johnacancienne wrote:


People who take a look at movies and try to deduce some sort of religious theme out of them are pretty well over the top anyway. Stuff like that is for entertainment only (although I fail to see how one is entertained by horror and gore) and rarely if ever reflects the true nature of a religion. You must have missed that in Sunday School, Dave, and grew up thinking that's just "One More Way" to be seduced by the devil. If that is true, then you're in the wrong line of work. You'd fit in better as the prosecution, rather than the defense.





Are you going to argue that Narnia and Lord of the Rings are entertainment only?-continue to believe that-its some of the best propaganda we have going.

Non Quis, Sed Quid
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 11:59AM #17
johnacancienne
Posts: 7,314

Jul 6, 2011 -- 11:58AM, davelaw40 wrote:


Jul 6, 2011 -- 11:35AM, johnacancienne wrote:


People who take a look at movies and try to deduce some sort of religious theme out of them are pretty well over the top anyway. Stuff like that is for entertainment only (although I fail to see how one is entertained by horror and gore) and rarely if ever reflects the true nature of a religion. You must have missed that in Sunday School, Dave, and grew up thinking that's just "One More Way" to be seduced by the devil. If that is true, then you're in the wrong line of work. You'd fit in better as the prosecution, rather than the defense.





Are you going to argue that Narnia and Lord of the Rings are entertainment only?-continue to believe that-its some of the best propaganda we have going.





Yes, Dave I do argue that point. Also Mother Goose, and the Brothers Grimm, and that little freaking red haired mermaid! Or do you believe that goats and trolls live under bridges collecting tolls of travelers as they cross?


 

It isn't about waiting for the storms to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain.
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 12:06PM #18
davelaw40
Posts: 19,669

Jul 6, 2011 -- 11:56AM, johnacancienne wrote:


 


You brought up Harry Potter, Dave. Not me. If you were speaking of the books Harry Potter, I never read them. My daughter did in High School, and loved the characters in each one. I don't know if the Exorsist ever was a book. I was going into anything, really that has some sort of religious undercurrent to it....


Right now.... Man, I'm lost. I don't know where you're trying to steer the conversation.


 




I've read all the HP books, read the Exorcist / never seen the movie.


I'll rephrase the question (although since you never read the books/ you might not be able to answer)


Are the HP novels a better representation of the craft than the book mentioned in the OP? were you turned off by the Christianity hidden throughout the HP series?


 

Non Quis, Sed Quid
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 12:09PM #19
davelaw40
Posts: 19,669

Jul 6, 2011 -- 11:59AM, johnacancienne wrote:


 


Yes, Dave I do argue that point. Also Mother Goose, and the Brothers Grimm, and that little freaking red haired mermaid! Or do you believe that goats and trolls live under bridges collecting tolls of travelers as they cross?


 




they are socialization tools-don't travel alone/ be careful of strangers/bridges are dangerous-thats just the Billy Goats

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6 years ago  ::  Jul 06, 2011 - 12:38PM #20
johnacancienne
Posts: 7,314

Jul 6, 2011 -- 12:06PM, davelaw40 wrote:


Jul 6, 2011 -- 11:56AM, johnacancienne wrote:


 


You brought up Harry Potter, Dave. Not me. If you were speaking of the books Harry Potter, I never read them. My daughter did in High School, and loved the characters in each one. I don't know if the Exorsist ever was a book. I was going into anything, really that has some sort of religious undercurrent to it....


Right now.... Man, I'm lost. I don't know where you're trying to steer the conversation.


 




I've read all the HP books, read the Exorcist / never seen the movie.


I'll rephrase the question (although since you never read the books/ you might not be able to answer)


Are the HP novels a better representation of the craft than the book mentioned in the OP? were you turned off by the Christianity hidden throughout the HP series?





My wife has been a practicing witch for over 20 years now; her grandmother who was 97 when she died, even longer. Neither ever pointed a wand and knocked someone across a room. And gods know I gave them reason enough through the years. It's a childrens' book, Dave. And it plays to every fantasy given to witch craft and sorcery. I rank it with the Disney animated movie where Mickey Mouse was the Sorcerer's Apprentice. As I recall, there was no outcry and hue from the Christian community over that.... maybe it was because it was a mouse making all of those mops and buckets move under their own volition.


I saw no undercurrents of Christianity in those movies either. Maybe a lesson in ethics, but that being said, Christianity does not hold the monopoly on ethics.

It isn't about waiting for the storms to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain.
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