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6 years ago  ::  Apr 25, 2008 - 5:05PM #1
StoryMing
Posts: 39
[QUOTE=clyde5001;455389]Jesus himself was Jewish, as were all his first followers (a fact which alone ought to make Christian anti-Semitism an impossibility)

But it didn't. [/QUOTE]

Right, unfortunately. The key word was "ought".

[QUOTE]Xianity engaged in an orgy of murder towards the Jewish people for over a thousand years.[/QUOTE]

I have heard something about the pogroms, of course; but, an orgy of murder? I don't know whether you are referring to the Nazi's Third Reich or not, but Hitler and his movement, at any rate, was not done in the name of Christianity.

[QUOTE]It will take hundreds, if not thousands, of years before we can bring ourselves to trust Xians again. And the never veiled attempts of the fundigelical community to convert us stops the healing process almost completely.[/QUOTE]

I have a sneaking suspicion we may not have hundreds or thousands of years. According to Judaism, if I understand correctly, the Messiah must show up by the year 6000 on the Jewish calendar, which equates to the year 2242 BCE.
---That's less than 240 years from now.
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7 years ago  ::  Jan 17, 2008 - 2:55PM #2
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 15,305
Some lovely  and unidentified person complained to Beliefnet that they were offended that I happened to mention that Messianic Judaism is not Judaism, and that so called "Messianic Jews" are not Jews.

Well, I am sorry. But it is true. You can not be Jewish and worship Jesus. If you worship Jesus, accept Jesus as your "personal savior", view Jesus as the "perfected man," or any other such thing you are not Jewish.

Sorry if the fact that you are not Jewish offends you.

The fact that you insist on calling yourselves something you are not is what is truly offensive.

So called "Messianic Judaism" is offensive and an insult to Jews everywhere. It is a shame that Beliefnet chooses to ignore this fact.
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7 years ago  ::  Jan 17, 2008 - 3:31PM #3
nieciedo
Posts: 5,617
That's absurd.

If someone can't handle this little thing we call "reality," that's their problem, not yours.

MJism is not Judaism, never has been, and never will be. MJs are not Jews.

If that offends anyone, then boo-friggin'-hoo. Grow a pair.
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7 years ago  ::  Jan 17, 2008 - 5:39PM #4
aklamwoods
Posts: 975
Someone may have been offended, but most Jews feel the way you do.  In fact, Beliefnet was so impressed by the very first thread started by you, on new Bnet, that your quote was posted on the Community Home page.  It isn't against ROC, as far as I know, to state your beliefs.
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7 years ago  ::  Jan 18, 2008 - 5:41PM #5
aklamwoods
Posts: 975
Your not alone RS.  Another lovely and unidenified person was offended when I quoted (I Corinthians 12:15-rest of chapter) in which it states we're all a small part of the Body.  The foot is not the hand, and the ear is not an eye, etc., but we need each other.  We're only a small body of the Body with One Spirit.  It takes all of us to make the House of God.  My quote came from the Bible, but someone was offended.

It's pitiful when one has to report to Beliefnet because of differing opinions, esp. when this is a debate board.  My opinions are from the NT.  I did not break any ROC. 

I wonder how anyone could let someone else have power to make them angry.  No one can take away God's Spirit from me.

I'm sending good thoughts and vibes to the one who did this because they are truly hurting, and I have all the compassion in the world for them.
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7 years ago  ::  Jan 18, 2008 - 6:42PM #6
rocketjsquirell
Posts: 15,305
Aklam

I can see someone disagreeing with a quote from the NT or arguing the meaning of the quote but being insulted by it? On a debate board? What's up with that?

I take exception to a few passages here and there (mostly the antisemetic ones) but gee whiz it is nothing to get all huffy about. I guess some people are not ready for a debate board.

Good Shabbas, have a nice weekend. Hope to chat with you more on Monday
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7 years ago  ::  Jan 19, 2008 - 1:42PM #7
kollo
Posts: 4,064
[QUOTE=rocketjsquirell;220774]Some lovely  and unidentified person complained to Beliefnet that they were offended that I happened to mention that Messianic Judaism is not Judaism, and that so called "Messianic Jews" are not Jews. [/quote]
From the Christian pov, they are not Christians, not Messianic followers, at all. Christians believe that the Messiah foretold in Genesis, before Judaism was ever thought of on earth, was Jesus of Nazareth, and that true Jews accept him as such. Iow, Judaism, or Abrahamism, is now Christianity, as was always the divine purpose. To Christians, there is no distinction whatever between Gentiles who become believers and Jews who become believers, and the term 'Messianic Jew' is profoundly anti-Christian. The MJ movement is merely another attempt by Satan to smuggle Judaising practices into Christianity. As Paul wrote, "Beware of the dogs!"

It is anyway quite difficult today to say that there is such a thing as Judaism of the Tanakh/OT variety. There is no Jewish priesthood, Temple, sacrificial system, homeland occupied by twelve tribes, nothing at all is left except historic ruins, and the Hebrew/Aramaic Scriptures, which are both now as much Christian property as anyone's. To claim any sort of Judaism (as distinct from Christianity) is not really claiming anything.
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7 years ago  ::  Jan 19, 2008 - 8:02PM #8
clyde5001
Posts: 3,501

kollo wrote:

From the Christian pov, they are not Christians, not Messianic followers, at all. Christians believe that the Messiah foretold in Genesis, before Judaism was ever thought of on earth, was Jesus of Nazareth, and that true Jews accept him as such. Iow, Judaism, or Abrahamism, is now Christianity, as was always the divine purpose. To Christians, there is no distinction whatever between Gentiles who become believers and Jews who become believers, and the term 'Messianic Jew' is profoundly anti-Christian. The MJ movement is merely another attempt by Satan to smuggle Judaising practices into Christianity. As Paul wrote, "Beware of the dogs!"

It is anyway quite difficult today to say that there is such a thing as Judaism of the Tanakh/OT variety. There is no Jewish priesthood, Temple, sacrificial system, homeland occupied by twelve tribes, nothing at all is left except historic ruins, and the Hebrew/Aramaic Scriptures, which are both now as much Christian property as anyone's. To claim any sort of Judaism (as distinct from Christianity) is not really claiming anything.



Xians stole the Jewish bible and then killed us when we reminded that their religion was nothing but a heresy.

But it is far more than a heresy - it is base idolatry. Worshipping a man - especially a dead man - is a sin.

I pity those who take i (Xianity) too seriously. It will be their spiritual undoing the false philosophy will die on the vine.

Shema Y'Israel Adnai Eloheinu, Adonei Echad.

Am Y'Israel Chai!

23,298 posts as of 2/27/2009

3,208 after the transition.

A 20,090 difference.
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7 years ago  ::  Jan 19, 2008 - 8:21PM #9
kollo
Posts: 4,064
[QUOTE=clyde5001;226212]Xians stole the Jewish bible and then killed us when we reminded that their religion was nothing but a heresy.


The first Christians were Jews- it took a while for them to realise that all were 'eligible'. It was Jews who killed Christians. The people who later attacked Jews were fake Christians (some of them ex-Jews), who had in produced Judaistic legalisms into their caricature of Christianity. They did this probably because they perceived a need to distinguish themselves from actual Jews.

But it is far more than a heresy - it is base idolatry. Worshipping a man - especially a dead man - is a sin.


Christians would say the same, and it is hardly responsible or even sensible to say that that is what they reckon to do. If people wish to argue that Jesus was not 'immanuel' they are of course welcome to do so.

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7 years ago  ::  Jan 19, 2008 - 8:33PM #10
clyde5001
Posts: 3,501

kollo wrote:

The first Christians were Jews- it took a while for them to realise that all were 'eligible'. It was Jews who killed Christians. The people who later attacked Jews were fake Christians (some of them ex-Jews), who had in produced Judaistic legalisms into their caricature of Christianity. They did this probably because they perceived a need to distinguish themselves from actual Jews.


Christians would say the same, and it is hardly responsible or even sensible to say that that is what they reckon to do. If people wish to argue that Jesus was not 'immanuel' they are of course welcome to do so.



JC is a man who died, was buried, and was never seen again. To worship such a character will lead to the death of one's soul.

It was Jews who killed Christians.

That never happened because the book of Acts and Pauls is nothing but lies and Xian propaganda. The winners write history.

The people who later attacked Jews were fake Christians (some of them ex-Jews)

That would be about, what, just about any Xian who has ever lived - included Hitler, Himmler and their band of merry man.

If you go by your bible, there has never been a real Xian, but they have never stuck to anything taught in the pages of that book - except to engage in an orgy of murdering Jews.

But thatnks for the (typical) anti-Semitic post. At least we know where your kind stands and can easily dismiss you as not worthwhile.

Shema Y'Israel Adnai Eloheinu, Adonei Echad.

Am Y'Israel Chai!

23,298 posts as of 2/27/2009

3,208 after the transition.

A 20,090 difference.
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