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5 years ago  ::  Jan 22, 2008 - 4:36PM #51
lookingforinsight
Posts: 587
Okay, I've read this whole thing a few times and I have to admit that math was never my strong point. I follow your logic and trust your interpretation on the time spans of the periods (430, 480, etc.), but it seems to me that you would have to have the correct starting point for everything else to fall into place.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this seemed to be the starting date:

[QUOTE]Egyptian bondage 430 = 1877bc-1447bc[/QUOTE]

How do you know the Egyptian bondage started in 1877bc? Or if I misread/misunderstood what is the date you use as a starting point?

Also, would the leap years play into the calculations over such a long period of time?
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 22, 2008 - 7:38PM #52
Palmtree0
Posts: 3,231

lookingforinsight wrote:

Okay, I've read this whole thing a few times and I have to admit that math was never my strong point. I follow your logic and trust your interpretation on the time spans of the periods (430, 480, etc.), but it seems to me that you would have to have the correct starting point for everything else to fall into place.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this seemed to be the starting date:

How do you know the Egyptian bondage started in 1877bc? Or if I misread/misunderstood what is the date you use as a starting point?

Also, would the leap years play into the calculations over such a long period of time?


                                  I've mentioned earlier that the life spans and genealogy of the biblical patriarchs were actually calendar references. The biblical genealogies and monarchies are recorded from the time of Adam to Christ. The crucifixion is a known point of reference in history. Therefore, the genealogies and monarchies can be simply calculated back to the significant biblical event of the 430 years in Egypt as another reference point.


Leap years are not a problem because the calculations are in reference to the biblical or celestial clock; which require no adjustment for leap years. Below is a demonstration of the perfect mathematical alignment between the genealogy of four biblical patriarchs that lived during the time that ancient Israel spent in Egypt.     
  Levi 77 years in Egypt 
Kohath 133 years in Egypt 
Amram 137 years in Egypt 
Aaron 83 years in Egypt 
430 years total time

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5 years ago  ::  Jan 23, 2008 - 9:34PM #53
OnewayOneLord
Posts: 1,013

Palmtree0 wrote:

I've mentioned earlier that the life spans and genealogy of the biblical patriarchs were actually calendar references. The biblical genealogies and monarchies are recorded from the time of Adam to Christ. The crucifixion is a known point of reference in history. Therefore, the genealogies and monarchies can be simply calculated back to the significant biblical event of the 430 years in Egypt as another reference point.


Leap years are not a problem because the calculations are in reference to the biblical or celestial clock; which require no adjustment for leap years. Below is a demonstration of the perfect mathematical alignment between the genealogy of four biblical patriarchs that lived during the time that ancient Israel spent in Egypt.
Levi 77 years in Egypt
Kohath 133 years in Egypt
Amram 137 years in Egypt
Aaron 83 years in Egypt
430 years total time



Ok Palmtree0 so time was calculated by patriarchal generations..In the case that you have listed above...Levi was the son of Jacob and he was about 60 years old when they entered into captivity and then it ended with Aaron who was the brother of Moses. It is Exodus chapter 12 that I quoted below but it is chapter 14 that Moses parts the Red Sea.

there is 430 years was the amount of time in which the Israelites were in captivity. And there is 430 years and 4 generations from Levi ( Son of Jacob) to Aaron.
Exodus12:40-41:


Now the sojourning of the children of Israel, who dwelt in Egypt, was four hundred and thirty years. And it came to pass at the end of the four hundred and thirty years, even the selfsame day it came to pass, that all the hosts of the LORD went out from the land of Egypt.

So, what appears to be happening is that God is using the patriarchs to mark the passage of time in the form of a calander. In particular and in your example above God specifically denotes the 400 years with the life spans of Levi and his decendents . Is there a significance to the 4 generations or not?

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5 years ago  ::  Jan 24, 2008 - 9:09AM #54
Palmtree0
Posts: 3,231

Is there a significance to the 4 generations or not?


Yes, absolutely this is significant! You will want to read Genesis chapter-15 where the Egyptian bondage was prophesied well in advance of the actual events.    


Genesis 15:13 
And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed (descendants) shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years; And also that nation, whom they shall serve, will I judge: and afterward shall they come out with great substance. And thou shalt go to thy fathers in peace; thou shalt be buried in a good old age. But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.

 
   
The advance message from God regarding the events which would occurred to Abram's descendants  is yet another consistent and re-occurring pattern which is demonstrated throughout the scriptures?   


Malachi 3:6
For I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.



Therefore, It is God's unchanging consistency which reinforces the concept that He will not carry out his plans until He first reveals them through His prophecies.


Amos 3:7
Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but (until) he reveals his secret unto his servants the prophets.



God's consistent and unchanging pattern of linking His prophesied events with precision to the celestial calendar, is in itself in direct opposition to those whom delight in proclaiming that “nobody can know WHEN” the prophesied events will occur.



John 14:27-29
Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid. Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I. And now I have told you before it come to pass, that, when it is come to pass, ye might believe. 



Those whom insist on promoting their religion of: “don't know, can't know”, identify themselves by their own statements, that they are not the children of light.

1 Thessalonians 5:1-4
But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.

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5 years ago  ::  Jan 24, 2008 - 1:33PM #55
lookingforinsight
Posts: 587
Well, Palmtree, I think you presented an excellent case but I have to be honest and admit that I'm skeptical. Please don't think that means I'm hostile to the ideas you've presented; I'm merely skeptical.

I do want to tell you, though, that I admire the amount of time and study you've put into this. It's an amazing job, and I thank you for taking the time to explain it all to me. And just because I'm skeptical, don't think I don't respect that.

So I'd like to ask, with all due respect, what if 2011 comes and goes and nothing happens? Would you just consider your calculations off somewhere, or would it become more of a crisis of faith?

Please excuse the indelicate wording of that question. I'm not very good with words, and I can't think of how to better ask politely what I'm trying to ask.

(Or course, it something DOES happen by 2011, I'll withdraw the question!)

:-)
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 24, 2008 - 2:34PM #56
Palmtree0
Posts: 3,231
Who am I that you should not be skeptical of me? You don't know me from Adam. I would be somewhat alarmed if you hung on every word stated by me. So, I'm not surprised by your skepticism of me. Besides that, Christians are admonished to test (try) the spirits among them.   


1 John 4:1
Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. 


Nevertheless. there is a difference between doubting me and doubting the written Word of God. Why are you NOT doubtful that Christ is the Messiah? I have no doubt that Christ is God, and that Christ is the Messiah; because I believe the scriptures.


So the scripture's message about 2011 are no less the Word of God than the scripture's message about Christ being the Messiah. The reason to display the scriptures with my statements was to that let the scriptures speak to you apart from me. So now, if you choose to doubt the scriptures, what does that have to do with me??


John 20:29
Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed. And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book: but these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 24, 2008 - 3:03PM #57
subtleguy01
Posts: 2,593
Palmtree,

In the event that you are wrong about your 2008-2012 timeline, would it be OK for us to place you in the category of False Prophet?  :confused:
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 24, 2008 - 3:32PM #58
Palmtree0
Posts: 3,231

subtleguy01 wrote:

Palmtree,

In the event that you are wrong about your 2008-2012 timeline, would it be OK for us to place you in the category of False Prophet?  :confused:



It seems to me by our previous discussions that you have already placed me in that category.. So, is there any love lost?   

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5 years ago  ::  Jan 24, 2008 - 3:54PM #59
subtleguy01
Posts: 2,593
Palmtree, in response to Jerry's question about being a False Prophet if her timeline doesn't come true, offered: "It seems to me by our previous discussions that you have already placed me in that category.."

Jerry: Not true at all, Palmtree. Frankly, your Calvinistic theology places you at odds with both many Christians and non-Christians. While I disagreee with your personal spiritual beliefs, I've never considered you to be a False Prophet. I just think you have some very odd beliefs and I'm sure you think the same about me. Instead, I'm asking your permission to call you a False Prophet if you are wrong about your end times timeline. Fair enough?   

Palmtree again: "So, is there any love lost?"

Jerry: Since you've never demonstrated any love towards anyone else posting at these threads,  how can something that doesn't exist be lost?
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 24, 2008 - 4:03PM #60
Palmtree0
Posts: 3,231

subtleguy01 wrote:

, I'm asking your permission to call you a False Prophet if you are wrong about your end times timeline. Fair enough?   



Why would you need permission??

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