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Switch to Forum Live View Drinking age 21....should this be changed?
5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 4:55PM #21
TemplarS
Posts: 6,690

Sep 17, 2009 -- 3:18PM, Nepenthe wrote:


Some people (smarter than me) have presented arguements that binge drinkning by underage students in college is most likely a symptom of the drinking age, and that if it were lowered to 18 or 19, much of the binge drinking would disappear. 





I dunno, based on personal experience (me in college when the drinking age was 18) I don't buy that.  But neither do I think binge drinking would be any worse if the drinking age were lowered.  It's just the tendency of that age group to get wild and crazy.

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5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 5:38PM #22
Roodog
Posts: 10,168

Sep 17, 2009 -- 10:16AM, Tmarie64 wrote:


Sep 16, 2009 -- 9:04PM, Roodog wrote:


There's been a lot of trouble with college kids getting drunk and hurting themselves and other folks. This is why Colorado had raised the drinking age to 21.




That's just not a legitimate argument.  College students still drink.  Under 21s still drink.  This silly law did nothing to stop that.





Take it up with the Legislature, I didn't write the silly law.

For those who have faith, no explanation is neccessary.
For those who have no faith, no explanation is possible.

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If one turns his ear from hearing the Law, even his prayer is an abomination. Proverbs 28:9
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5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 5:44PM #23
Erey
Posts: 18,569

I think it will be hard to lower the age, I think the tendancy is to say leave well enough alone.


 


I came of age during the era of MADD (Mothers Against Drunk Driving) which I hardly hear anything from anymore.  And during that time there was ALOT of debate and carrying on that it should be OK to drink and drive.  Afterall people had been drinking and driving for years. People even claimed to drive BETTER drunk.  This is all hard to believe now.


And the penalties of driving while drunk were not that bad.  Sometimes you got arrested, sometimes the cops might just drive you home or if they didn't think you were that bad off let you drive yourself home if you were close enough.  There was no DUI felony


There was not this conciousness, a strong morality of not drinking and driving.  Now I believe a person who would admit to driving drunk is considered of low charecter.  There has been a shift in conciousness.  And I do think it is bad morality to drive drunk.  The only problem being many times drunks don't see themselvs as drunk. 


I think we have the morality shift in our favor should we choose to lower the drinking age.  I really don't care if kids want to have a party and make asses of themselves.  But I will do just about anything to prevent them from killing themselves in a car. 


If we were to lower the age I think society could adjust but I don't think we will.

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5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 7:43PM #24
rangerken
Posts: 16,406

The current drinking age is ridiculous.


First, the best way to make sure teenagers, particularly American teens, do something is to tell them they are too young to do it.


Second, if someone is old enough to fight and die for their country, and to vote, they damn well ought to be able to drink.


Ken

Libertarian, Conservative, Life member of the NRA and VFW
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5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 7:46PM #25
SatanicStalker
Posts: 719

The major problem with allowing 18 year olds to purchase alcohol is that it then makes it far, far easier for people in high school under 18 to get hold of alcohol. After all, being friends with a senior who is 18 is far more likely than having someone who will buy you, a minor teenager, alcohol over the age of 21.


But, as has been implied here, there is a difference between a glass of wine with dinner and binging on a couple bottles of whiskey. Likewise, there is a difference between buying and drinking alcohol. My understanding of the laws in my local area is that minors may drink alcohol IF it is given to them by their parents AND consumed on their own property. 


Consequently, as a 15-16-17 year old, I occasionally had a mixed drink or wine cooler on a Friday night while playing cards with my family, at home. 


I believe that simply lowering the drinking age would be bad. As an EMT who has responded to many alcohol-related MVAs, I know a bit what bad can be. I also know that alcohol poisoning can be a bad deal too. But one of the unfortunate truths about the collisions in particular is the fact that often the drunk driver is unhurt or only minorly injured, whereas often the people the drunk ran into suffer much greater damage. Drunks tend to stay loose in a collision (or maybe they just can't react fast enough to tense up) which actually minimizes injuries to an extent, whereas sober people tend to tense up, which can lead to worse injuries.


Just lowering the age would not, in my opinion, do anything to curb the interest in drinking by those people that would then be able to legally drink for the first time, but it would make it easier for all interested parties to get ahold of alcohol and make it more socially acceptable, which I imagine would increase bingeing and driving under the influence. 


Places (as in countries) where teenagers can legally drink are often paraded around as the model we should follow. The problem is that such places typically have a completely different context of social norms and expectations. If you are 18 and going off to college and you expect there will be binge drinking and parties, the notion that you can now do this legally is not going to dampen your interest or expectation. 


I would support more progressive sorts of options, such as allowing minors to have a drink at a restaurant or bar if purchased for them by a parent. Or a graduated drinking age that perhaps allows 19 year olds to buy a single beer or hard lemonade but not a case of either, nor hard liquor. Educating everyone about alcohol is a great idea but I really doubt that a simple class needed to get a drinking license would actually help that much. Working in food service I had to take a class on food service safety. It was made for the lowest common denominator and thus was stuff I already knew, common sense stuff. More than that, though, the final quiz was a joke... all one needed to do was memorize the correct answer and be able to spit it out, there was no internalizing of any of the information. If someone had been inclined to not wash their hands enough or cut vegetables on a board just used for raw meat, the class might have made them vaguely aware that this wasn't the way it was supposed to be done, but it would do almost nothing to get them to actually do it right. Driver's education classes may not be college anatomy, but they do at least teach things that many of the students would not know otherwise, teach habits and skills in an internalizable way, and actually test on a person's ability to do it right, not just know the right way it's supposed to be done, the right sound-byte answer. Somehow I doubt that an alcohol safety class would have a practical exam. 


Although that might be useful... have someone drink various amounts, say how drunk or not drunk they feel, then have their blood alcohol actually tested and (later, once sober) watch a video of themselves trying to solve problems at that level of intoxication, myth-buster style. That might stand a chance of being internalized. But that could get expensive to administer. 


Of course, a huge advantage of a drinking license would be being able to take it away from repeat offenders of alcohol-related misconduct. Then, you could be 42 with two DUIs and your being over 21 wouldn't matter, no place could legally sell you a drink. 


~Stalker

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5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 9:01PM #26
Stardove
Posts: 15,237

Sep 16, 2009 -- 11:38PM, Dreamweever2 wrote:


Oh (((Stardove)))....I'm sorry. I didn't mean to do that. I remember when my ex was in the army. I hated the times we were apart.



No, no Dreamweever we were not married yet.  While Hank was in Vietnam I was married to another man who decided to get killed in an auto collision.  He may not have decided, but an 18 wheeler took him and his passenger truck out.  Long time ago.  My third child was born on what would have been our 11th wedding anniversary.  My last gift from him. 


It all had to happen for me to find that hurt man I kept praying to God I could take care of.  For two hours I prayed for my husband not to be dead, but dead is dead.  God did hear me say over and over I could handle a hurt man.  At 4:00 AM the police came to my door telling me my husband was DOA at the hospital.  I already knew it. 


I was referring to too many tours in Nam, because Hank is 100% disabled PTSD veteran.  We were married for many years before he sought help with me demanding he get help from the VA.  The drinking part in Nam was true though.


So I married my wounded being I told God I would take care of. I thought Hank was the craziest person I had ever met when I first got to know him.  He does better today than in the past.  He's almost a hermit for the main part, but does go to doctor appointments, family events, sports games of grand-children and even the Kroger.  That was a biggie for him to master the Kroger alone.  Smile


 

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5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 9:07PM #27
mainecaptain
Posts: 21,783

 


 


 




Satanic Stalker, I think your ideas are really good, I like the graduated idea of an 18 year old being able to buy a single beer, but not a case. Or a Parent being able to buy a glass of wine at a restaurant for their teenager and so on. That would encourage drinking responsibly, and it would take away the taboo and mystique to a certain extent.  

A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious. On the other hand, they do less easily move against him, believing that he has the gods on his side. Aristotle
Never discourage anyone...who continually makes progress, no matter how slow. Plato..
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on other lives" Jackie Robinson
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5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 9:57PM #28
Dreamweever2
Posts: 733

Stardove, you are a brave lady. I am sorry that I brought back the memories to the surface. I'm glad to hear that Hank is doing better these days though. It sounds like you've both have been through a lot. Sometimes it's strange the ways that prayers get answered isn't it?

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5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 10:55PM #29
Stardove
Posts: 15,237
Texas Law. 

If a minor is in the presence of parent, legal guardian or spouse they can legally drink.


§ 106.04 – Consumption of Alcohol by a Minor

(a–b) A minor commits an offense if they consume alcohol unless they are in the visible presence of, and have the consent of their adult parent, legal guardian, or spouse.



I too think Satanic Stalker makes some good points.

Dreamweever, not to worry.  Life is what it is.  Everyone has their challenges to get through.  I have a daughter I would not have, if I hadn't gone through my loss of my first husband.  I love my life today, what more could I asked for?  Nada.....nothing.
Beliefnet Community Wide Moderator ~ Peace Love Stardove
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The words I speak and write carry energy and power, so I choose them with care and clear purpose. 

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5 years ago  ::  Sep 17, 2009 - 11:30PM #30
Dreamweever2
Posts: 733

Here in Indiana, adults caught giving alcohol to anyone under 21 gets hit with charges of contributing to the delinquency of a minor. Anyone under 21 is not allowed to enter a liquor store, or a bar even with parents. Liquor is only sold on Sundays here in establishments that sell a certain percentage of food business as well. No carry out liquor is sold at all on Sundays. Consequently, many people that live close to the state lines like will go to the neighboring states to buy liquor on Sunday, if the mood strikes them. It's a horse and buggy state.

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