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6 years ago  ::  Nov 17, 2008 - 3:00PM #1
imsavedru
Posts: 76
If a christian commits suicide, can they go to heaven?

Food for thought -tell me yours!!
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6 years ago  ::  Nov 18, 2008 - 9:39AM #2
imsavedru
Posts: 76
For the sake of discussion (LOL)...what happens if a person has unrepented of sin at the time of death- suicide would fall in that category I would think. Phil 4:8 tells us what we are to "think upon". A person who is suicidal not only doesn't know their identity in Christ (The Holy Spirit dwells within the believer), they have Grieved the Holy Spirit by an act "outside" of God's will (asumming that is not God's will to take control of one's OWN life) and they have not (obviously) applied Phil 4:8. If they had.... thoughts of suicide would not have overtaken them. The Word says that SATAN robs, kills, and destroys. If we were to kill ourself - are we not acting upon Satan's will and NOT God's?

We are also told to DENY ourselves and carry our cross. Suicide in NOT denying ourselves - it is the ultimate act of selfishness and hopelessness- NOT love. Our hope is to be in the Lord not ourselves. It might appear that the SAVED person (when they committed suicide) actually walked away from Jesus Christ.

I want to prompt a discussion here.
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6 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 2:47PM #3
Brownowl33
Posts: 443
[QUOTE=imsavedru;903539]For the sake of discussion (LOL)...what happens if a person has unrepented of sin at the time of death- suicide would fall in that category I would think. Phil 4:8 tells us what we are to "think upon". A person who is suicidal not only doesn't know their identity in Christ (The Holy Spirit dwells within the believer), they have Grieved the Holy Spirit by an act "outside" of God's will (asumming that is not God's will to take control of one's OWN life) and they have not (obviously) applied Phil 4:8. If they had.... thoughts of suicide would not have overtaken them. The Word says that SATAN robs, kills, and destroys. If we were to kill ourself - are we not acting upon Satan's will and NOT God's?

We are also told to DENY ourselves and carry our cross. Suicide in NOT denying ourselves - it is the ultimate act of selfishness and hopelessness- NOT love. Our hope is to be in the Lord not ourselves. It might appear that the SAVED person (when they committed suicide) actually walked away from Jesus Christ.

I want to prompt a discussion here.[/QUOTE]

I don't belong in this forum (I just saw the topic up here while I was browsing the main boards) but I'll chime in my two cents.  I have had friends that committed suicide, and it was just this line of thinking ("Their lives were so horrible that they killed themselves, and now God is punishing them in Hell for eternity for it!") that turned me from a Christian into an atheist.  If there is a god, I hope it's not to petty, spiteful, and hateful that it condemns to torture people who are so desperate that commit suicide.  Such a "god" wouldn't be fit for anything but contempt.

I don't doubt this post will be deleted, but since it is a personal issue I had to speak up for those who can't speak for themselves anymore. What a sick, disgusting theology
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6 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2008 - 4:56PM #4
imsavedru
Posts: 76
ChrisSuperstar -
Well, Im glad you are here - for whatever reason.  Why would this be deleted?  You have every right to an opinion - and you come from a personal place of having known people in a frame of mind that was so hurtful that suicide was an option for them. This question was intended to prompt a discussion - and it did. *SMILE*

Thank you for your perspective.  It IS valid. But let me say, it is not God who is unfair - it is people.  We dont have knowledge of others circumstances or see the "whole" picture in their life.  Only God knows each of us intimately. God is not a sadist- (one who is unfair and cruel and lacking understanding and wanting to see us hurt). Just by His nature He is........beyond love and compassion.

I was speaking to those who call themselves "Christians" and find themselves in desperate circumstances without hope.  Christians are to base their hope in Christ - hence, my question about these important matters regarding the LACK OF HOPE some might feel even though refering to themselves as christians.

Again........thank you for your contribution.  We can all learn from each other.

Peace.
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6 years ago  ::  Jan 19, 2009 - 6:40PM #5
kurnell
Posts: 309
imsavedru,
you need to spend time with those who suffer depression and are continually troubled with suicidal ideation.You would learn a lot and hopefully, be less judgemental.Christians are not exempt from this type of suffering.Only God and themselves, know the hell they endure.As Jesus showed us what the Father is like in the Gospels, a God of pity and compassion,He will met them in love and bring them into His presence for ever.
Pax
Jeffrey
Treasure your experience of God,however it comes to you.Remember that Christianity is not a notion but a way.
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 22, 2009 - 3:50PM #6
imsavedru
Posts: 76
kurnell -

You bring up a point worth pondering. While all people go through a gamet of emotions from joy to anger- (those being part of being human)  Christians who "continually suffer" from depression and suicidal thoughts are "oppressed" according to scripture. That is of the Enemy, not just a flesh or human struggle but a struggle in the spirit realm .Timothy speaks of having a SOUND mind.  One who is discouraged or depressed can certainly still have a sound mind - just as David in the Psalms said HE was discouraged. But If a person deals with an overwhelming and continual feeling of suicide and helplessness, the God of Hope cannot be in them as the Holy Spirit seeks to ensure a "Life more abundantly" according to Jesus. Jehovah God is a God of hope and rescue ( not intending or wanting his creation to suffer).  We will sometimes suffer from our own choices OR perhaps even from chemical or genetic reasons.  It does not dismiss one's responsibility as a Christian who has been "bought with a price" by the blood of Jesus . Killing themselves is not an innocent action. It is saying "Jesus is not enough and is not my healer".  That my friend, is a lie.

By the way, my brother suffers from depression and has spoken of suicidal thoughts.  He is an atheist.  Enough said.
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 23, 2009 - 7:17AM #7
kurnell
Posts: 309
imsavedru,
Your fundamentalist interpretation of scripture would be of no use to someone suffering depression. It offers no hope, only condemnation and pain.Like Job's 'comforters', never entering into the pain of the sufferer, just standing by and passing judgement.
May God open your eyes and give you a compassionate heart.
Pax
Jeffrey
Treasure your experience of God,however it comes to you.Remember that Christianity is not a notion but a way.
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 23, 2009 - 9:13PM #8
imsavedru
Posts: 76
"Jehovah God is a God of hope and rescue ( not intending or wanting his creation to suffer)."  I wrote this in my last post.  You overlooked that and other things I said regarding Jesus being the Healer and that our life is HIS and not our own.  This is a Christian post - therefore my speaking of the Holy Spirit  and Jesus' promise of a life MORE ABUNDANT is quite appropriate. Those words are quite hopeful.

It seems that your judgement of my comments has actually made you the judgmental one.
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 23, 2009 - 9:15PM #9
imsavedru
Posts: 76
what hopeful words do you have to offer?
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5 years ago  ::  Jan 30, 2009 - 11:55PM #10
Mark_The_Servant
Posts: 5
The Lord Jesus Christ is Savior but he is also Lord. What is he Savior Of? Is he just a get out of  "jail free card", or is he Savior from sin? The Bible makes it very clear that faith alone cannot save? Faith is required and without it one cannot be saved...but faith without works is dead. One who is believing and walking in that belief will also be speaking and renewing their mind in the Word of God which is the seed of faith whereby one grows.Faith is the substance and the evidence that one has passed from death into life. To say that I believe, and do contrary is proof that I have not believed with the heart (spirit). To say that I have hope in the Lord without patience...is not hope at all. If I hear and not do....my faith is no different than the devil. He believes and even trembles...yet it does not change him at all.

Someone who commits suicide is not believing in the Word and is sinning. The Bible says that we are not our own but are bought with the precious blood of Jesus. If he died for all, then all should die to themselves. The Bible says that God will not allow us to be tempted above what we are able to bare...but will with the temptation make a way of escape. In order to commit suicide one has to say, "I am not able to bare,"  and calls God a liar, and God cannot lie nor will he be found unfaithful on judgment day.

God puts before us life and death..and he tells us to choose life. He will not violate our will. He has given us a free will...but will hold us accountable to the choice that we make. As long as we are in this body we have a will to choose because God gave us a material body to sense the material world around us. But, when we die our spirit does not have free will nor can we choose. The spirit world will be determined by the choices that we made in this life according to the Word of God.

We are told to try Jesus....he is presented as a passive Lord that humbly waits at the hearts door begging for an opportunity to prove his love to soverign mans will. But the truth of the matter is he is not coming as a suffering lamb, but as a risen Lord. He has defeated the devil, triumphed over sin, and has received an incorruptible inheritance which was discussed between the Godhead before the foundation of the world. He demands Lordship over a humble mans heart. He is to be worshiped in the spirit, soul, and the body. He is to be honored, adored, exalted in everything we do...and we are to serve him with fear. He is love...and a consuming fire. He is the lamb of God....and the lion of the tribe of Judah. He brings peace...and a sword. He sings and dances over the righteous....but he will punish and destroy all who are unrighteous.

The beginning of wisdom is to fear the Lord!
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