Post Reply
Page 3 of 4  •  Prev 1 2 3 4 Next
6 years ago  ::  Jan 15, 2009 - 11:25PM #21
Gadgett
Posts: 10
I don't know if Im just missing something or not. But yes I am very serious about this. Yes there needs to be death for life to go on but what purpose would a needless death have? If you are attacked and your life is in danger do you defend yourself or do you say that my death will allow life to continue?

Second, I said nothing against Neo looking for council. I only threw my opinion in and then was very surprised when the sum of most of the responses were "Unless she asks then he shouldn't get involved" So I commented on it. If I have misread something please let me know and I will be more that happy to appoligize. I never claimed to understand everything.

I am all for respecting people's rights to do as they will. But sometimes they CANT ask for help.cause they don't know how. trust me when I said I wish someone had interviened on my behave then I was in trouble.

Honestly, I think that that is one of the biggest problems with this world today. No one is willing to help each other out anymore. Maybe I just live with old fashioned ideals. But at least Im willing to explore the chance Im wrong and learn to grow.

And again I will say... Neosage, I think that is a outstanding idea. I'll be praying.

-Gadg
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Jan 16, 2009 - 12:27AM #22
Bunsinspace
Posts: 5,922
[QUOTE=Gadgett;1022255]... If you are attacked and your life is in danger do you defend yourself or do you say that my death will allow life to continue?...[/QUOTE]

BS"D

That is why I wrote my bear story.  It is all very subjective, so it needs to be balanced.

If you met this woman and determined she did not know how to ask for help (instead of clearly rejecting it as was already pointed out by Geosage) how would you proceed?  What skills do you have that would elevate a fellow human being to that point?  If I had my skull pierced by a nail from a nailgun and I shied away from your desire to remove the nail, how would you go about elevating me to the point where I would release my natural fear and let you pull it out?  And if I then actually died from your well-intended life-saving efforts of removing a nail from my skull through the subsequent fatal brain hemorrhage, would you feel justified in your actions with no regret or would you feel a pang of responsibility?

I am only posting this to point out that we don't really have a clear picture of the seemingly malevolent intent attributed to the actions of this spirit.  It could equally be a case of ignorantly accusing a CPR-giver of breaking the ribcage of a person while saving their life.

This is a case where you are NOT arguing against those who disagree with your position at all but you are arguing for a specifc action to be employed universally while others are arguing that may not be the case in this instance.

But I perceive much more is going on here.  The fact that you are so overcome by this person's plight indicates to me that you are meant to be personally involved somehow.  You might want to inquire privately with GeoSage on this one.
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Jan 16, 2009 - 6:59PM #23
Tenlionz
Posts: 1,790
I believe the Gadget don't get it, I'm not sure what base of study she iz involved in but this response causes me to question her knowledge in this field. Not attempting to hurt your feelings Gadget but I believe you are simply inexperienced. I would expect this kind of response from a follower of Oprah. Should you attempt to save the life of the unwilling you are now speaking of behavioral health care, this would entail an E.O.D or an Emergency Order of Detainment. She would be cuffed and transported to a Mental Health facility for a 72 hour observation period then she would be prescribed anti depressants and turned into a virtual zombie. This iz the way of thoze who do violate the reality of destiny and create an existence outside the circle, which iz an abomination of creation. You can not force Spirits to leave one that willingly invites their presents, this iz the law of the Spirits, not if you want to or not, it simply can not be done.
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Jan 16, 2009 - 8:08PM #24
Kay404
Posts: 174
Bunsinspace, thank you for sharing that story – it has great power and depth.

I agree that people cannot be healed against their will. 

On the other hand, I don’t agree that spirits have the right to abuse the living, even if the living have been tricked into believing that the spirits “love” them.  My focus in this situation would not be on forcing  healing on the living person, but, rather, on stopping the abuse by the spirits – just as I would call the police if I saw someone being attacked on the street.

Spirits can be offered help and healing in exchange for leaving a person alone.  A surprising number, when they see the energy being offered, will take the help – because, in fact, they never really do get what they need from their living victims.  If the spirits refuse help, they can be taken by powerful helping spirits to a place of confinement, where help and healing remain available to them, but they are not allowed to harass the living. 

It’s true that the living person may end up connecting with other ill-intentioned spirits, but the two spirits described in this situation seem more dangerous than those most people encounter most of the time.  Hopefully the living person would have a chance to learn from the situation without being so much at risk of having the lessons of this lifetime cut short.

If the person has literally allowed the spirit into their body – partial or complete “possession” as opposed to the spirit simply being attached or “clinging” to them – the situation is more complex.  I have never needed to deal with such a situation when the living person was not willing to have help, so I would have to journey about it.  As Ten Lionz says, it may not be possible to do a depossesion under those circumstances -- though the helping spirits may have ways of doing things that a living human, even a holy person, might not be able to do.  I don't know that they could, but I wouldn't rule it out until the spirits themselves tell me it's not possible.  In any case, hopefully this is not a case of true possession.

GeoSage, I’m glad you’re looking to your Upper World allies for guidance.  If you’d also like to talk over possible techniques, or hear some of my experiences, I’d be happy to discuss this more with you.

Bright blessings on your path

Kay
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Jan 16, 2009 - 8:47PM #25
Tenlionz
Posts: 1,790
Yes Kay and I would agree if this were a Human Spirit manifestation but in this particular case the extent of oppression showz these Spirits to be Malignant in nature,  akin to and possibly Red Spirits. Identifying the rift or dimensional shift (door left open) could help in verification of Human Spirit activity and identification. In this case one could of course offer help and counsel to theze particular Spirits and in effect exorcise the Red or malignant Spirits by sending the Human Spirits on their merry way. I have often witnessed complete relief of multiple Spirit activity by way of exorcising of the single Human Spirit manifestation. Although free will comes back into play when you speak of a person who willfully invites the Spirits to stay. Should you check existing rites in nearly any cultural structure you will find the words "not welcome here" This welcoming scenario in its self precludes most all rites, incantations and spells found in the bag of the Master Exorcist. Thus I conclude this particular scenario to be a Human being not in crisis but in a state of learning by Devinne intervention and design.

Ten lionz
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Jan 16, 2009 - 9:24PM #26
Tenlionz
Posts: 1,790
Well said High Pockets, I would also seriously discourage poking about in the outer realms attempting to find a Spirit to bargain with concerning this particular scenario, you may encounter a Spirit much more malignant in nature and or Spirits familiar to the Spirits you are attempting to oust. Even ascended Masters, Snake Priests, Horn Doctors and Alikchi are cautious when attempting to bargain with Spirits in the world which borders our own. Do not allow vanity to enter your heart and make you feel worthy of tasks far above you, lest you pay a very dear price
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Jan 18, 2009 - 1:08PM #27
kraventhearcher
Posts: 170
In addition to these wizened statements, I would only add that the OP has mentioned that they know this person but don't "know" them intimately.
I would remind everyone that to intrude into someone's life with preconceived notions about what the situation may be is very foolish indeed.
You never know who people are. You never know what their life is like, until you really and truly come to know them. And, very often that can take years.
What this condition or predicament seems to be is a first person narrative of what this person believes is going on in their life.
We have no way to know if this person is mentally ill, a scammer in need of attention, or if they are telling the truth.
People lie. And, they lie for all manner of reasons. I'm not going to go so far as to say this person is a liar. Quite the opposite.
My entire point here is none of us know the details apart from a second hand narrative of a very personal experience. To recommend anything is to go off half-cocked. No Shaman worth his or her salt should be doing that. To delve into the deep end of the pool with someone else's issues without looking can reap you your own lessons while you think you're heroically jumping into the fray to save someone else.

And, that's why I say to let this person work it out on their own. To be sure it speaks well of anyone who holds out a hand to help their fellow human. And, it's nice to see someone want to "fix" another's problems. Seldom can you "fix" another person's issues. You can support them. But, you can't fix them.
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Jan 18, 2009 - 5:49PM #28
Tenlionz
Posts: 1,790
if they are telling the truth.
People lie. And, they lie for all manner of reasons.///// Now thats a chunk of meat that had not been pulled from the pot. Well done Kraven and well said.
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Jan 18, 2009 - 1:08PM #29
kraventhearcher
Posts: 170
In addition to these wizened statements, I would only add that the OP has mentioned that they know this person but don't "know" them intimately.
I would remind everyone that to intrude into someone's life with preconceived notions about what the situation may be is very foolish indeed.
You never know who people are. You never know what their life is like, until you really and truly come to know them. And, very often that can take years.
What this condition or predicament seems to be is a first person narrative of what this person believes is going on in their life.
We have no way to know if this person is mentally ill, a scammer in need of attention, or if they are telling the truth.
People lie. And, they lie for all manner of reasons. I'm not going to go so far as to say this person is a liar. Quite the opposite.
My entire point here is none of us know the details apart from a second hand narrative of a very personal experience. To recommend anything is to go off half-cocked. No Shaman worth his or her salt should be doing that. To delve into the deep end of the pool with someone else's issues without looking can reap you your own lessons while you think you're heroically jumping into the fray to save someone else.

And, that's why I say to let this person work it out on their own. To be sure it speaks well of anyone who holds out a hand to help their fellow human. And, it's nice to see someone want to "fix" another's problems. Seldom can you "fix" another person's issues. You can support them. But, you can't fix them.
Quick Reply
Cancel
6 years ago  ::  Jan 18, 2009 - 5:49PM #30
Tenlionz
Posts: 1,790
if they are telling the truth.
People lie. And, they lie for all manner of reasons.///// Now thats a chunk of meat that had not been pulled from the pot. Well done Kraven and well said.
Quick Reply
Cancel
Page 3 of 4  •  Prev 1 2 3 4 Next
 
    Viewing this thread :: 0 registered and 1 guest
    No registered users viewing
    Advertisement

    Beliefnet On Facebook