rbchaddy2000 wrote:

Look I am for accepting gays, but gay pride makes me uncomfortable. I think that this welcoming idea could be quite divisive if embraced in such detail and dogmatically. I have a libertarian side that says that this is a leftest agenda best left open to personal decision rather than from on high in a strictly prescibed way. Be open to all, but leave out the training. This gives me a reason to remain an independent religious liberal that refuses to officially affiliate with either the AUC which dogmatizes on God, or the UUA that tells me how to be officiallly welcoming. Spare me from both.

Richard, do you realize how much this looks like the old "I've got nothing against gays, but I don't want them shoving their lifestyle down my throat"?

Why does Gay Pride make you uncomfortable?

Leftist agenda? Best left open to personal decision? THAT reminds me of "I'm all for civil rights, but they're moving too fast. Nobody should be forced to sit near blacks in restaurants or serve them or let them in the front door or go to school with them, etc.

I'm not saying you're a bigot, Richard. What I'm saying is that your remarks here, in this thread, are strikingly similar to things I've heard all my life from "conservatives" about desegregation, about tolerance (much less acceptance) of gays, about women's rights, and just about everything else that is out of the norm, something that threatens a comfy status quo. I'm wondering why you're having difficulty with change..with things you perceive as political stands being forced on you (or others).

Ok, here's the last bit of confusion. I perceive a negative vibe when you say something like "leftist agenda," you say you have some Libertarian in you, you describe yourself as a religious liberal.
In your mind, what's the difference between "leftist" and liberal?
Are you feeling kind of like the pushme-pullme? Being pulled in opposite directions?

darcamani wrote:

What I am seeing here is very similar to what I experienced within my own progressive, liberal tradition.
" All are welcome"
Certainly!!!
We are UUs!

Then lttle things started getting noticed , during joys and concerns , a fairly traditional time in a service to share as a community highs and lows, anniverseries birsths, deaths , what have you, a lesbian couple, well known and active within the church from early growing up, announced their umteenth anniversery, a milestone normally greeted with gentle laughter and applause, was received in dead silence.

Heterosexual pride applauded moments before, for a small newly married het couple with a baby.
2 hets managed to breed, and were applauded, 2 lesbians,partnered and having lived through a great deal of hell, managed to live together and stick together through much more, awarded with silence.

Sometimes being liberal takes a little extra home work. Self work..

I can't be sexist, I am a woman .
I can't be racist, I am black!
I am way to smart for all that or, I am a therapist! I CAN"T be ... or certainly AM NOT!.!!!!
Or I am A liberal !
Or I am A UU! Or my favorite to date, I am a lesbian Republican and have no problems with any one!

This is an important point, Dar. Thank you so much for posting it.

I've discovered that it's when I'm congratulating myself most fervently for how tolerant I am, I'd better start examining just how valid that tolerance actually is.

AintKatie makes some significant points in this regard as well. Thanks to you, too.

bob2 wrote:

Political correctness actually gets in the way of sharing and support. PCness can create an "I am more saintly than you atmosphere". On the other hand, I am concerned about your question,  " Is it about politics or religion? "

I guess PC is a buzz term that means different things to different people. To me, saying something is PC is the same as saying it's the current fad or the current annoyance. "Oh, gee. Now I have to be PC and not say 'wetback' when referring to people with Mexican ancestry."  If Political Correctness is the reason UU congregations are deciding whether or not to become Welcoming Congregations, then, imo, the whole thing is a sham.

My own congregation is going to start working on it and if I get a hint that the work is strictly for PC, I'll vote against it. But I don't believe it will be. There already are members in my congregation who are gay/lesbian and at least one transexual person. I reckon if anybody was going to be a jerk about such things, they've already left.

Where was I? Oh, how much I don't like that PC thing. For me, what is now referred to in a negative way as PC is almost always what I would consider common decency. The whole point of bringing things to people's attention, consciousness-raising, is to make life more equitable in the USA. It's to give blacks, browns, yellows, and reds, disabled, women, gays/lesbians, children, everybody..every body..a fair and decent shot. I can't imagine what could be wrong or negative about that. So, I say..let's get rid of the Politically Correct terminology and start calling it Common Decency. I'd like to see people muttering, "Oh, CD. What a bore."  :rolleyes: