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6 years ago  ::  Jul 19, 2008 - 4:11PM #1
hahayana
Posts: 77

Today there was a big article in my local newspaper about the Creation Museum in Petersburg, Ky. The museum opened to the public in 2007 and has had 250,000 visitors in the first 6 months since opening.


The museum tells the Bible's version of Earth's history - that the planet was created in a single week 6,000 years ago.


http://www.answersingenesis.org/


Is the corresponding web site. Check it out! This is for real.

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6 years ago  ::  Jul 19, 2008 - 9:24PM #2
Frank Burton
Posts: 445

Hahayana, I've attended a lecture by the Director of the Creation Institute of Santee, CA.

The Director said, "The 98% shared genes between apes and humans are just evidence that God used the same blueprint for our similar biologies."

So I asked him, "Then why do we share some of the same junk DNA and pseudogenes -- the same bad code?"

(Assuming apes and humans gained their identical junk DNA and pseudogenes by a means other than shared inheritance of a common ancestor's mutations is like assuming Bill Gates writes a separate buggy Windows code for every PC, instead of just copying one original bug-infested Windows code.)

The Director's response? "Junk DNA and pseudogenes must have some secret purpose we do not know that caused God to give the same ones to both apes and humankind..."

Hmmm...

In contrast to the creation "scientists," I do know why God would have had to give apes and humans the same junk and pseudogene DNAs.  It would be for the same reason He would 6,000 years ago have had to create a 13-billion-year-old universe and a 4.5-billion-year-old earth -- to make sure we come to Him not through any evidence, but through faith alone.

Frank Burton
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 19, 2008 - 10:14PM #3
hahayana
Posts: 77

Namasteji Frank!


I was wondering if ANYONE would field this. Smiling, as a serious amateur Astronomer. BTW The Earth IS Flat!, and the Sun revolves around it. Rolling around on the floor laughing. And crying at the same time. Welcome to the future!

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6 years ago  ::  Jul 22, 2008 - 7:16PM #4
indep
Posts: 324

I am astonished, I just don't believe it, that in the 21st century in an age where science and anthropological and archaeological evidence have been around for more than 100 years, anybody can still deny evolution!  This in a 'modern' country.


hahayana, I had no idea the earth was flat ... rofl Laughing

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6 years ago  ::  Jul 22, 2008 - 9:03PM #5
citizenzen
Posts: 49

The really crazy part is that this goes far beyond just the disciplines of anthropology and archaeology.

Chemistry, botany, biology, genetics, geology, nuclear physics all contribute to proving evolution is a fact (and probably a lot more disciplines I've failed to mention). If this were merely about people interpreting fossils, that would be one thing. But the evidence is corroborated across many fields of science. 

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6 years ago  ::  Jul 23, 2008 - 10:52PM #6
bigbear6161
Posts: 3,612
What I have always found remarkable is how strongly these folk's religious faith and identity is woven into a literalist reading of the Bible.  It's evident when you see the bizarre and convoluted arguments they will come up with to preserve a non-mythological reading of Genesis.  What I really object to is when such folks criticize my sincerity and question my self-identification as a Christian because I accept the overwhelming scientific arguments in favor of evolution.  This is one reason we need groups like the Circle of Reason, to show that reasonable people exist in darn near every religious and philosophical tradition.
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6 years ago  ::  Jul 24, 2008 - 12:21AM #7
citizenzen
Posts: 49

Christians have the perfect creative moment in the "Big Bang", the whole universe, all space and time, spewing forth from nothingness.

Now that's creation! 

As you stated, bigbear, it's that insistence that the Bible is literally true that is mind-boggling. I'm curious to know why people cling to this notion so fiercely, even in the face of overwhelming evidence.

Would Christianity collapse if the Bible was acknowledged as something less than the literal truth? I think not. 

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6 years ago  ::  Jul 24, 2008 - 11:56AM #8
Robby1957
Posts: 131

micro and macro-evolution

The difference between micro and macro-evolution is a major point of confusion between the Christian worldview and the Darwinian evolution worldview in today’s culture. Micro-evolution is the adaptations and changes within a species while macro-evolution is the addition of new traits or a transition to a new species. Micro-evolution is a fact that is plainly observable throughout nature. Macro-evolution is a theory that has never been observed in science. Evolutionist usually argue that those who believe in creation are ignoring the facts, however, there is nothing that evolutionist observe in science that creationist or Christians as a whole disagree with. The point of contention is not on what is observed, but the belief systems that interpret what is being observed. Nothing in the Bible contradicts science; it is the assumptions that evolutionists insert into their world view that contradict the Bible. Evolution is a hypothesis introduced as a possible explanation of origins. In this article, the goal is to explain the difference between micro and macro-evolution and show why micro-evolution cannot result in macro-evolution.


 

[ Click Here ] for more information  


 

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6 years ago  ::  Jul 25, 2008 - 8:19PM #9
bigbear6161
Posts: 3,612

Robby,


The way science works is by constucting theories based on observation, and then testing these theories by experimentation (if able) or the gathering of evidence to see if the theoretical construct is consistent with such evidence.  Vigorous debate and alternative viewpoints are encouraged and bit by bit the theory more nearly explains and predicts the actual state of the system.  It is recognized to be a verbal paradigm of a non-verbal experiential reality.  The theory of evolution has survived more than 100 years of scientific inquiry and it has adjusted iteslf accordingly to fit the available evidence.  It is quite useful at the moment.  Undoubtedly it will continue to be refined until someone proposes a new paradigm that better explains what we find and see.  However, what creationists do is try to make the evidence fit the theory, namely that the biblical creation story is an historical fact.  They object to seeing it as a mythopoetic interpretation but assert it is a scientific interpretation.  When they offer supposed evidence, it doesn't hold up because the process they use is backward.  They do more to drive thinking people away from the beauty of an experiential knowledge of God than any atheist.  I like to quote the wise words of Pope Leo XIII : The Church has nothing to fear from the truth!

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6 years ago  ::  Jul 26, 2008 - 6:39PM #10
Frank Burton
Posts: 445

Amen, BigBear!

There is a small contingent of people in rural Newfoundland, who, from inbreeding over the last several generations, have acquired, through genetic drift, a chromosomal translocation (literally, a part of one chromosome has moved to another), that prevents them from having any fertile offspring with any mate outside their community of distant relatives.

They are literally a new species of humans -- Homo sapiens 2.

Should the U.S. and major Canadian cities ever get nuked, it is entirely possible that this isolated fishing community will thrive, populate the remainder of North America, and -- after a few hundred thousand generations of now completely separate micro-evolution, will be very different morphologically from us.

Speciation is thought to arise like this all the time -- as a sudden reproductive barrier, whether genetic or geographic -- followed by gradual acquisition of morphological changes.

And finally, neither the hypothesis of micro-evolution nor the hypothesis of creationism can explain the presence of shared pseudogenes in chimp and human DNA -- only the hypothesis of evolution can. That data is real, and invalidates all other hypotheses -- which is why the hypothesis of evolution is now a theory, consistent with all available scientific evidence and invalidated by none of it.

Sorry, Robby. God created earth via evolution, or created it to appear so, to be sure all come to Him by faith alone.  But what's so bad about that? 

Frank Burton
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